Whats the result on this?

[DoubleDees]

Scenario:

Player A and player B throw the same disc on the same hole both clearly marked. They have similar shots. Player B marks his lie and throws his approach, putts out and moves on to the next hole. Player A sees what he believes is his disc 20 foot or so into water and is unable to retrieve the disc. Marks his lie as ob and plays the hole out.

Player A gets a 4p
Player B gets a 3



Several holes later Player B realizes he has player A's disc.

[RonTheWhip]

Several holes later...its too late to make any calls or enforce any penalties.

However, if it were discovered right away then the ruling is: play out the hole from the wrong lie and add two strokes...

803.10 Throwing From Another Player's Lie



A. A player who has thrown from another player's lie shall receive two penalty throws, without
a warning. The offending player shall complete the hole as if the other player's lie were his
or her own. No throws shall be replayed.

B. The player whose lie was played by the offending player shall be given an approximate lie as
close to the original lie as possible, as determined by the offending player, a majority of his
or her group, or an official. See section 803.11 C if the disc has been declared lost.

[Chuck Kennedy]

It's never too late for penalties until the TD has given out awards and declares the event is over. Two rules can be used to handle this situation and both result in each player getting two throws added to the scores they recorded (4p & 3). Rule 801.04D on misplays discovered after additional holes have been completed adds 2 throws per player. Or, 803.13A(2) on inadvertently not holing out adds 2 throws to each player. The fact that Player B played from another player's lie and caused Player A to also play from another player's lie gets washed out since player A didn't discover the problem while the hole was being played to get the proper lie and no penalty.

[DoubleDees]

So does player A still receive the penalty stroke for being ob?

[mazza]

Originally Posted by DoubleDees

So does player A still receive the penalty stroke for being ob?

i think player a should have the penalty stroke removed because it was player b that was ob

[Chuck Kennedy]

Nope. Each player gets the score they recorded + 2. Both players screwed up even though player B started the cascade of errors. The only way player A wouldn't get any penalty is if he (or Player B) discovered the problem before he marked and threw. Once he threw, he had played from another player's lie and would complete the hole with a 2-shot penalty and not get the OB penalty. Once the hole was apparently completed before the error was discovered, the presumed score stands and the 2-shot misplay/incomplete penalty is added. I think the revised rules for 2011 are going to require that discs be marked on both sides to reduce the need for flipping discs for identification and help prevent situations like this.

[LakeStevensBA]

Is there a penalty if player A kicks player B in the groin for being such a douche? Or would he get a warning first?

[mazza]

Originally Posted by LakeStevensBA

Is there a penalty if player A kicks player B in the groin for being such a douche? Or would he get a warning first?

personily i would call it an ace and give player A the $1 and sign his disc

[Ol' Bob]

That wouldn't be a foot fault?

[Jeff Hemmerling]

Originally Posted by Chuck Kennedy

I think the revised rules for 2011 are going to require that discs be marked on both sides to reduce the need for flipping discs for identification and help prevent situations like this.

Ugly!

[essjay]

"I think the revised rules for 2011 are going to require that discs be marked on both sides to reduce the need for flipping discs for identification and help prevent situations like this."

Chuck, can the rule be a bit more complex, allowing discs that are unique (i.e., dyed discs) to not have to be marked on both sides? I understand the need for production discs, but a dyed disc is, in and of itself, a unique identifier. Just a thought for all those guys out there who don't want to tag up their pretties.

[emmarose]

Originally Posted by essjay

"I think the revised rules for 2011 are going to require that discs be marked on both sides to reduce the need for flipping discs for identification and help prevent situations like this."

Chuck, can the rule be a bit more complex, allowing discs that are unique (i.e., dyed discs) to not have to be marked on both sides? I understand the need for production discs, but a dyed disc is, in and of itself, a unique identifier. Just a thought for all those guys out there who don't want to tag up their pretties.

can the 2011 revised rules have something that disallows for jack asses to play the sport...

[Scott]

Originally Posted by essjay

"I think the revised rules for 2011 are going to require that discs be marked on both sides to reduce the need for flipping discs for identification and help prevent situations like this."

Chuck, can the rule be a bit more complex, allowing discs that are unique (i.e., dyed discs) to not have to be marked on both sides? I understand the need for production discs, but a dyed disc is, in and of itself, a unique identifier. Just a thought for all those guys out there who don't want to tag up their pretties.

I'm guessing that it will. The current rules don't require a name and phone number, although that's what most of us use to uniquely mark our discs. They simply require a "unique identifier". I'd assume that a dyed disc qualifies.

[Chuck Kennedy]

I think the rule would likely be similar to the current one which would say something like, "uniquely marked on both sides." That would allow for dyed sides to not have a mark on them if the dye and disc color combo was unique. But how would you know that more weren't made unless you dyed it yourself?

[Bullseye]

Originally Posted by Chuck Kennedy

I think the rule would likely be similar to the current one which would say something like, "uniquely marked on both sides." That would allow for dyed sides to not have a mark on them if the dye and disc color combo was unique. But how would you know that more weren't made unless you dyed it yourself?

In all honestly, I think that proposed rule is absurd. It sounds like a knee-jerk solution to a non-problem. Seriously, if someone makes a mistake and throws from the wrong lie because they didn't bother to make certain it was their disc, then they take the penalty. That should be the end of it.

[Scott]

Originally Posted by Chuck Kennedy

I think the rule would likely be similar to the current one which would say something like, "uniquely marked on both sides." That would allow for dyed sides to not have a mark on them if the dye and disc color combo was unique. But how would you know that more weren't made unless you dyed it yourself?

I can see that leading to arguments, or at least discussions. Aren't fly-dye discs all technically unique? As far as I know, they're done by hand, right? An artist will repeat the same general idea several times and, at first glance, some might look the same. But all will have small variations making them unique.

Allowing custom dyed discs seems like a no-brainer, though.

[Chuck Kennedy]

In all honestly, I think that proposed rule is absurd. It sounds like a knee-jerk solution to a non-problem. Seriously, if someone makes a mistake and throws from the wrong lie because they didn't bother to make certain it was their disc, then they take the penalty. That should be the end of it.

Consider how absurd it is that we even allow custom discs at all for professional competition. The ones used for competition should be factory hotstamps and weighed for compliance if we were following the lead of other professional sports.

[emmarose]

Originally Posted by Bullseye

In all honestly, I think that proposed rule is absurd. It sounds like a knee-jerk solution to a non-problem. Seriously, if someone makes a mistake and throws from the wrong lie because they didn't bother to make certain it was their disc, then they take the penalty. That should be the end of it.

amen, brutha.

[Bullseye]

Originally Posted by Chuck Kennedy

Consider how absurd it is that we even allow custom discs at all for professional competition. The ones used for competition should be factory hotstamps and weighed for compliance if we were following the lead of other professional sports.

Oddly enough, I would support this idea more than the idea you mentioned earlier. Unlike having ink on both sides of the disc, overweight discs do make a difference in flight characteristics.

[Chuck Kennedy]

Of course these discs would need to be marked on both sides since so many would look alike...