Re design VS Alt pin locations

[Parks]

Originally Posted by Sean Johnson

So hole 14's pin is in the wrong placement? I'm wondering how we managed to misplace 14's pin and 2's teepad when were were at a SDGA work party with two board members present.

I meant current 14.

[Parks]

Originally Posted by Burge

Bear in mind that I was framing my comparison within the context of my own personal preference and that I said my usual choice of strategy on either hole was a skip shot.

Risk/reward is always personal preference. You measure the risk vs. the reward for a particular shot and decide whether to throw it or not. It doesn't, of course, exempt you from taking riskier shots that you are more familiar with over safer shots.

Originally Posted by Burge

Driving straight at the chains is never a good idea, would be a stupid and brash maneuver in tournament play, and would have been laughable on the old 6. Shooting at the ground 20' in front of the basket is what I found worked best for me in most situations on that hole. It was a way to play the hole aggressively and hedge my bets at the same time.

There are plenty of non-risky skip shots on old six, 20 feet short is playing it pretty close and approaching where I would try to skip an ace run. If you throw long at all you would be looking at a tough put over the edge.

[Parks]

Originally Posted by Burge

Don't you mean 15?

Nope, 15 is fine. Its the best that could be done without having a significant amount of discs going over the edge. I meant 14.

Originally Posted by Burge

Don't you mean 12? I guess it is old 15.

You're right on this one, current 12, old 15. Across the tennis courts.

Originally Posted by Burge

I think you've juxtaposed the numbers of the holes here, because otherwise, you're losing me...

Yup, I boobed the numbers.

Originally Posted by Burge

So, just like Sean asked (and I'm assuming this to be the case because putting 14's pin 25' to the right would place it deep in the schule) 15 is in the wrong place? I would think the temporary target in the same spot for weeks prior and Gordy's confidence in placement would not indicate such a discrepancy and, if true, is most disheartening since Sean J. and I are the ones that went through the effort to put the sucker in the ground.

Clarity?

25 feet to the right and a little further puts 14's pin smack dab in the middle of the fairway in the obvious green location that lets you put from anywhere within 25 feet or so around it. It may not be exactly 25 feet, but you get the point.

The temp target kept getting moved because it was in the way of the pin.

As for 15, we didn't set anything in stone, and it came out better than I expected. The exact words were something to the effect of "teepad somewhere near the old old tee area, and the pin a little shorter and to the right." The pad is a little close to the trees in front of it for my comfort, but I throw sidearm on the hole anyway so I'm not gonna break my hand if I foot fault.

Don't be disheartened. You did some good work out there, and I'm apparently the only one that cares.

[Yoduh]

Hole 1 needs a new pin placement. old hole one was a really tricky shot that required alot of skill. new hole ones is the easiest birdie in the world(overstated, but have not played many courses with an easier hole 1 that were supposed to be somewhat challenging). Also the green is dangerous to stand on. It needs to be moved permanently to the right and baack. The rock pile could be ob in a tourney. I have been thinking this forever and I know others have figured this out as well. Now that 2 is moved there is no reason not to fix it..

[Parks]

I agree with you on Hole 1. The only thing to take into consideration is shots from 1 and 17 crossing onto each other's fairways. However, I think that can be mostly avoided with a good pin placement.

[White Walls]

you could move the basket for hole 1 north about 30-40 feet. (basically what yoduh said) it would eliminate rhbh hyzers, and probably lhbh hyzers too. making the hole a little longer and having it require a straighter approach would make it a lot harder. something like that would make it play a lot like the 'old' hole 1 too.

[Sean Johnson]

While I will miss the easy bird, I agree with everyone on moving hole 1. Besides, I've been overshooting it anyways

[Burge]

Originally Posted by Parks

25 feet to the right and a little further puts 14's pin smack dab in the middle of the fairway in the obvious green location that lets you put from anywhere within 25 feet or so around it. It may not be exactly 25 feet, but you get the point.

I grok.

The temp target kept getting moved because it was in the way of the pin.

Come to think of it, I do recall it being in this location. I thought the change was 'official'. Oh well, I'm sad to say that digging the hole for its present location was a royal pain in the arse (lots of big rocks), but I think it would be worth it to go through the trouble of digging it out and putting it in the originally intended spot.

As for 15, we didn't set anything in stone, and it came out better than I expected. The exact words were something to the effect of "teepad somewhere near the old old tee area, and the pin a little shorter and to the right." The pad is a little close to the trees in front of it for my comfort, but I throw sidearm on the hole anyway so I'm not gonna break my hand if I foot fault.

I agree, and so do I(RHFH) on this hole. It's still a good deuce opportunity, but the basket is a little better protected and those saplings will continue to get bigger, making it even more tricky.

Don't be disheartened. You did some good work out there, and I'm apparently the only one that cares.

I wouldn't say you're in a class by yourself, but at least you're on a short list.

[Burge]

I emphatically agree with moving 1. I've been bombed on several times while putting ever since the tee was moved and would like to see this changed. It really has become the new most dangerous spot on the course.

[Parks]

Jshrack commented that I should post more of what is planned for DR on here.

In order.

Hole 2's pin will be moved somewhat to the right. No exact pin location was set, but I think the general consensus was that it was to the right and short of the path, beyond the dead tree.

Hole 3's pin will be moved up the hill and put just left of the path. There are a couple good areas, one that is as long as the current pin and one a little deeper. I think either one will work.

Hole 6 and 9 will probably be changed as a pair due to the erosion alongside 9, but there is little urgency for this change since it isn't severe. Hole 9's pin will be moved to the left, somewhat in the vicinity or hole 6's current pad, but not so far as to put it in the line of fire from hole 4. Hole 6's tee will be moved somewhere near the path where you come down from hole 5, and the pin will be moved out into the middle of old 8's fairway. This is a very cool shot if you've ever looked at it from this angle.

I've gone over the changes for 7, 8, and 15 elsewhere in this thread.

It hasn't been formally set in stone, but hole 1's pin will probably be moved back and to the right toward the open area near the rocks to increase both safety from hole 11 and the challenge. Hole 11's teepad may also move back to the path where it used to be, but I think that is just exchanging one safety issue for another (16 and 11 vs. 1 and 11).

I don't think its been discussed much, but either 17's pin or 2's teepad may be moved due to a fairly obvious conflict there. I'm of the opinion that putting 2's teepad near the fishing sign will make the hyzer route over 17's pin undesirable for people throwing with less than 500' of power, since it will be quite wide.

Another thing that hasn't been discussed but I think should be done is to move 14's pin out to the fairway area instead of locked against the jail trees. With the club's permission and a bag or two of concrete, this is something that I would be happy to do myself. I've heard claims of massive rocks in this area, though. Poop.

[Parks]

I typed this all up and most of it was already posted by the Public Relations board member Bob:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yoduh View Post
Hello?? Anyone? Ferris? Bueller? Anyone? Bueller?
The SDGA Board met on Satuday, June 12 to hammer out the details for the changes made to Downriver.

The changes that we voted in were:

1. Hole 2 would be changed such that the teepad will be moved somewhere near the "fishing sign" and the pin will be moved to the right some to direct discs away from the river and bank. Hole 2's current teepad can be left in place and used for Hole 12.

2. Hole 3 would be moved down the hill to prevent erosion behind the teepad. The pin would be moved up the hill to reduce the chance of discs going into the river or toward 4's teepad.

3. Holes 7's teepad will be moved back and to the left to direct discs more away from the river on the drive.

4. Hole 8's pin will be moved inland. The specifics are up in the air, but the shot everyone seemed to like was in between the area for 7's current teepad and old 8's fairway. The changes for hole 7 and 8 will ensure that the fairways don't cross, the hole 7 teepad area will be safer, and will alleviate the erosion issue near hole 8's pin.

5. Hole 14's teepad and pin will be moved back about 30 feet to allow more room for hole 15 to be adjusted without really changing the shot.

6. Hole 15's teepad and pin will be adjusted to prevent discs from going over the eroded hillside. An exact setup wasn't laid out, but it will likely be using the old teepad and the pin will probably be moved a little shorter and to the right.


Those are all the changes that were voted on.

There is also a suggestion to change holes 6 and 9, but it was deemed non-critical since the erosion along 9 is negligible since it is mostly rocky terrain on the bank. Its possible that those two holes could be changed in the future, but it is low priority.

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[Burge]

Originally Posted by Parks

Hole 2's pin will be moved somewhat to the right. No exact pin location was set, but I think the general consensus was that it was to the right and short of the path, beyond the dead tree.

The sleeve for 2's new pin location is already in the ground and I would say that it's pretty much in the exact place that you're describing. Look around on the ground..it has a red cap. I know that Joe was trying to create a dry lake 'hazard' to protect the few saplings guarding the hole, but the pin needs to get moved because the combination of the new pad and the old pin actually increases the chances of discs going over the edge.

I don't think its been discussed much, but either 17's pin or 2's teepad may be moved due to a fairly obvious conflict there. I'm of the opinion that putting 2's teepad near the fishing sign will make the hyzer route over 17's pin undesirable for people throwing with less than 500' of power, since it will be quite wide.

As I've stood on the new pad and looked at where the pin is going to be(soon), I agree that this is a problem, and that moving the pad, unfortunately, is the best solution. 17 was already shortened when it was changed from 20 and shortening it further would just be sad.

Another thing that hasn't been discussed but I think should be done is to move 14's pin out to the fairway area instead of locked against the jail trees. With the club's permission and a bag or two of concrete, this is something that I would be happy to do myself. I've heard claims of massive rocks in this area, though. Poop.

I've already expressed my alignment on this and, if permission is manifested, pm me or post for some help and I will do my best to finagle out of whatever responsibility I probably have at the time to give you a hand. I've got the 16lb. tamp iron that dug the last hole and most rocks wont argue with it. Plus, that earth in the fairway (trail) will be well packed. Maybe we could get Joe Glo to join in--he still has my shovel.

[Yoduh]

Quote by Parks:
It hasn't been formally set in stone, but hole 1's pin will probably be moved back and to the right toward the open area near the rocks to increase both safety from hole 11 and the challenge. Hole 11's teepad may also move back to the path where it used to be, but I think that is just exchanging one safety issue for another (16 and 11 vs. 1 and 11). End Quote by Parks

Hole 11's tee is still way more dangerous because new players can quite easily hyzer into the bowl of 1 which even if the pin is moved to a much better spot for me and other experienced players newer golfers are still going to land over by the bushes by old 1's pin and even shorter and to the left which is exactly where newer players throw from hole 11.
I have never heard of anyone getting hit teeing on hole 11. Most golfers with enough power to birdie hole 16 know if they have thrown a shot that could potentially injure people on Tee of 11. Also the people teeing on hole 11 have a clear unobstructed view of discs coming in their direction. Much safer than having your back turned to a disc coming in from behind you from a golfer that has no idea you are down below.

[Parks]

Originally Posted by Yoduh

Also the people teeing on hole 11 have a clear unobstructed view of discs coming in their direction.

The view is definitely not unobstructed, especially if the disc is coming in a bit low or fading hard.

[Yoduh]

Originally Posted by Parks

The view is definitely not unobstructed, especially if the disc is coming in a bit low or fading hard.

If its low then it gets me in the ankle not the head.

[Parks]

Not necessarily.

[Yoduh]

Ideally we should plant some trees at Downriver in a bunch of these places. Trees just to the left of 11's old tee would prolly suffice. Old 11's tee is safer than new.. the proof is in the pudding. That is why we are talking about these changes in the first place. I've never heard of anyone getting hurt on 11's tee because anyone that can throw far enough knows to yell four. Just as well wheneverI walked up to that tee the first thing I did was walk up and see if anyone was on the tennis court. Most people did this without thinking about it. That way you have plenty of time to react if you hear 4.

[coryreu]

Originally Posted by Yoduh

Ideally we should plant some trees at Downriver in a bunch of these places. Trees just to the left of 11's old tee would prolly suffice. Old 11's tee is safer than new.. the proof is in the pudding. That is why we are talking about these changes in the first place. I've never heard of anyone getting hurt on 11's tee because anyone that can throw far enough knows to yell four. Just as well wheneverI walked up to that tee the first thing I did was walk up and see if anyone was on the tennis court. Most people did this without thinking about it. That way you have plenty of time to react if you hear 4.

They would also block your view if a disc was flying in your direction.

[Parks]

Trees such as pine trees and some others can let you see fairly well while still catching discs.

[jshrack]

I saw an anchor hole for a new #1...
Nothing in it yet though.