Falling Putt

[OkieinOR]

I am trying to understand the true definition of a falling putt. The PDGA rule seems to be too vague as it says nothing about the state of the disc that you have thrown. It only states that you have to maintain balance. I think it is commonly accepted that if you are within 30ft, you must not make contact with any point in front of the back of your marker until the disc comes to rest, but again, the PDGA rule does not say anything about the state of the disc thrown. Can someone please clarify or point me to PDGA discussion that clearly defines a falling putt?

Thanks!


803.04.C
C. Any throw from within 10 meters or less, as measured from the rear of the marker disc
to the base of the hole, is considered a putt. A follow-through after a putt that causes the
thrower to make any supporting point contact closer to the hole than the rear edge of the
marker disc constitutes a falling putt and is considered a stance violation . The player must demonstrate full
control of balance before advancing toward the hole.

[Tim]

I'm not sure what you're asking exactly, since you seem to have a good understanding of it. But, FWIW, from the PDGA definitions:

Putt (falling) “ Falling Putt: A putt after which a player touches his or her marker disc, or any object beyond the lie, including the playing surface, before having demonstrated full control of balance.

[Scott]

I think he is asking, "Does the disc have to be at rest before the player can advance past his maker, irregardless of whether or not he maintained ballance?"

[Chuck Kennedy]

No. Basically, you complete what would be your putting motion, and if your non-plant foot comes off the ground, you place it back on the ground behind the mark demonstrating you're not going to fall over forward. BTW, you can fall over backward on the putt as long as all parts that hit the ground do so behind the mark. Once you have demonstrated balance, you can proceed toward your disc regardless whether it has come to rest. You can also run after it if it hits the basket and starts rolling away, especially toward, OB so you can snatch before it maybe disappears into OB once it has gone completely OB.

In the original post question, you are correct that the rule says nothing about the state of the disc in relation to when balance can be achieved.

[Tim]

Ahh, OK, I see now. Interesting, I could have sworn I saw in the rules before something about maintaining balance until the disc comes to rest. I guess truly though, if the player is still standing there windmilling his arms, trying to get balanced 3 seconds after the disc comes to rest, and then steps forward, that'd be a stance violation?

[Scott]

Originally Posted by Chuck Kennedy

You can also run after it if it hits the basket and starts rolling away, especially toward, OB so you can snatch before it maybe disappears into OB once it has gone completely OB.

Wait a minute....You can pick up a disc as it is rolling?

[jevon]

Originally Posted by Scott

Wait a minute....You can pick up a disc as it is rolling?

...once it has gone completely OB.

[Scott]

Originally Posted by jevon

...once it has gone completely OB.

That's not what I gathered from Chuck's statement.

[jevon]

Originally Posted by Scott

That's not what I gathered from Chuck's statement.

Then maybe you should read it again.

[Scott]

Originally Posted by jevon

Then maybe you should read it again.

Originally Posted by Chuck Kennedy

Once you have demonstrated balance, you can proceed toward your disc regardless whether it has come to rest. You can also run after it if it hits the basket and starts rolling away, especially toward, OB so you can snatch before it maybe disappears into OB once it has gone completely OB.

Seems to indicate you can pick it up before it goes OB.

[jevon]

Originally Posted by Scott

Seems to indicate you can pick it up before it goes OB.

Negative. Keep reading, you know, the part you didn't highlight. The part I quoted in bold the FIRST time around. He says "so you can snatch BEFORE it maybe DISAPPEARS into OB ONCE it has gone COMPLETELY OB."

[Scott]

Originally Posted by jevon

Negative. Keep reading, you know, the part you didn't highlight. The part I quoted in bold the FIRST time around. He says "so you can snatch BEFORE it maybe DISAPPEARS into OB ONCE it has gone COMPLETELY OB."

Sure... spell it out for me.
Actually, I had a real hard time with the way that was written. I just thought Chuck was being gramatically challenged.

It all makes sense now.

[Chuck Kennedy]

There was a situation at the Memorial where a spotter stopped a roller by a top player just before it went in the water with the spotter thinking he was helping save the disc even though he assumed the player would get the OB penalty. I can't remember the ruling for sure but I think the player did not get an OB penalty and got the lie right where the spotter "interfered" with it (803.07A).

[Bullseye]

Originally Posted by Chuck Kennedy

No. Basically, you complete what would be your putting motion, and if your non-plant foot comes off the ground, you place it back on the ground behind the mark demonstrating you're not going to fall over forward. BTW, you can fall over backward on the putt as long as all parts that hit the ground do so behind the mark. Once you have demonstrated balance, you can proceed toward your disc regardless whether it has come to rest. You can also run after it if it hits the basket and starts rolling away, especially toward, OB so you can snatch before it maybe disappears into OB once it has gone completely OB.

In the original post question, you are correct that the rule says nothing about the state of the disc in relation to when balance can be achieved.

So what you are saying is Romito's patented, but highly ineffective, fade away jump putt is completely legal.

[all2common]

Style points though!

[SMOKIN JOE]

being a pdga official you must maintain ballance after it comes to rest ,, so yes you could fall forward well after the disc comes to rest and still be a foul,
also if it hits the basket and rolls towards o.b. over a hill and you run after it to save it's still a foul,the disc has not come to rest, I saw this last year at whistlers on 13 ,someone was atop the basket putting downhill ,missed the putt and started walking down the hill after it,that should have been a violation , don't know if called,but no you can't chase after your rolling putt

[SMOKIN JOE]

the rule there would have been to place it where it was touched or the player may take a rethrow, two stroke penalty to caddies player

[SMOKIN JOE]

sorry he said spotter not caddie no penalty

[jevon]

Originally Posted by SMOKIN JOE

being a pdga official you must maintain ballance after it comes to rest ,, so yes you could fall forward well after the disc comes to rest and still be a foul,
also if it hits the basket and rolls towards o.b. over a hill and you run after it to save it's still a foul,the disc has not come to rest, I saw this last year at whistlers on 13 ,someone was atop the basket putting downhill ,missed the putt and started walking down the hill after it,that should have been a violation , don't know if called,but no you can't chase after your rolling putt

That's not what Chuck just said.

Once you have demonstrated balance, you can proceed toward your disc regardless whether it has come to rest.

[Scott]

Sounds like you can chase after your disc, but not touch it until it comes to rest.