Flippin ze disc

[Tennessee]

Originally Posted by ChUcK

He should probably be ok, then. Five hundred bucks will get him back to Sacramento in a hummer limo while nibbling on rare delicacies.

??? And what world do you live in?

[Tim]

Originally Posted by Gordy #21004

For my money it was Parsely the rookie handing out the K-note rumors.

Ahh yeah. I try to only listen to Rosemary. She's got some sage advice if you've got the thyme.

[ChUcK]

A world in which subtle hyperbole is often misunderstood by the bitter masses. Barsby will be just fine.

[snap7times]

Gregg is from Grass Valley, not sacramento, sacramento is the ewwwww.... That is why I don't live there heh... and about the first place prize... As a TD myself who tried to get the top players on the west coast to go to ODDGC, I made alot of promises and was able to keep them, barely... There is added cash and there is money expected to be added from entry fees and when a low number of entry fees actually comes in, then there are alot of issues. I am sure the committee for the flippn ze disc were hoping for at least 20-30 more players and that itself would have pushed the payout way up.. Same for ODDGC, I had over 12-13 people drop at the last minute and that is over $400 that is now not in the payout... sucks it wasn't a thousand, but at least it was over $500.

[KP65]

Here, is the truth of the matter the forest service stepped in on the friday, the day before the tournament and said if the tournament was going to happen on their land. Then we had to pay 5% of all entry fees ,disc sales, and on the BBQ sales. They had never discussed that with us before. Along with making us change 8 holes at the last minute as well. So the pro payout was not as good as expected. The other truth is that there was $4200 dollars added to the tournament. Not just to the 16 open players. The other truth is that nobody ever promised Barsby $1000.00 Dollars!!!!!!!!!
It was mentioned to him and others that we thought it could be possible that the winner might get $1000.00 dollars. Beacause that was our goal. However that is far different than promising him a $1000.00 dollars. And had the extra $600+ dollars gone into the tournament and not to the forrest service , etc. And the tournament actually filled that probably would have happened.
Furthermore, Barsby should have been man enough to talk to us about it directly instead of bad mouthing us to everyone else. And having his buddy's post stupid crap like this.
And still more I spend over 200 hours getting sponsorships and put up $700 dollars of the cash myself. As well get all the banners, tee signs, and artwork done at no cost to the tourament. We also provided free camping and all the beers that they could drink saturday night at uncle uli's.
I guess next year we should charge all campers $ 10.00 per night camping and we should make them pay for the beers, all so one guy can take home 25-50% of everything that was added to the tournament.
And by the way I had committed to giving up another $1500 this year in sponsorship of other tournaments here in Washington State. However after hearing you pro's cry about how much more you feel your do, I'm pulling all of my sponsorships, I had committed already to these tournaments off the table. Someone else can sponsor their Depends diaper and kleenex.

[Tennessee]

Not once did he bad mouth any of you guys he was just disappointed in the pay out and thats what i posted previously.
I think you should keep the kleenex for yourself friend.
Now i'm Done!

[Sam]

Originally Posted by KP65

Furthermore, Barsby should have been man enough to talk to us about it directly instead of bad mouthing us to everyone else. And having his buddy's post stupid crap like this.

What would that have accomplished? Judging from your ridiculous response here, it would have accomplished nothing.

And by the way I had committed to giving up another $1500 this year in sponsorship of other tournaments here in Washington State. However after hearing you pro's cry about how much more you feel your do, I'm pulling all of my sponsorships, I had committed already to these tournaments off the table. Someone else can sponsor their Depends diaper and kleenex.

Wow... you've got some serious "I am going to take my ball and go home" issues. Did mommy not love you enough or something? Not enough hugs at home?

Were you to drop off of the face of the planet and never TD another event, it sounds like you would be doing the sport a huge favor. There will be plenty of adults to step up and more than fill your child-sized shoes, I am sure.

By the way.. I wasn't at your event, I will not attend any of your events and I do not play pro. I do not like people who set up false expectations that they cannot deliver on. Perhaps you should have taken the sponsorship you had planned to donate to other events and paid the park since you clearly didn't have all of your ducks in a row before the tournament? Sounds like you should have bitten the bullet on that one and not left people thinking that you're a liar. Just a thought...

[TYVEK]

whooaa now. hold on.

KP65 is a good guy. he has been supporting disc golf in many ways for a long time now. the post he put here might have been a little dramatic, but i dont think anybody should be jumping down his throat here. that was his first post and he just joined today. he could be a great assett to this forum, but not if you roll out the welcome mat with all the barbed wire on it like you are doing.

[Sam]

Yeah... he makes a great first impression.

Let's see... set up false expectations that you can't or won't deliver on and then act like a 4 year-old when someone expresses their disappointment. Classy. Doesn't sound like much of a TD if he can't take open and honest criticism.

[Scott]

Originally Posted by Sam

Yeah... he makes a great first impression.

Let's see... set up false expectations that you can't or won't deliver on and then act like a 4 year-old when someone expresses their disappointment. Classy. Doesn't sound like much of a TD if he can't take open and honest criticism.

No need to fight anger with more anger.

[Wobbly Bob]

Hey KP35, the same thing happened the first tournament I ran. It was the Inaugural Lilac City Open in Spokane. There was a statement made by ??someone?? that we were gonna pay 1st place a $$GRAND$$. That was my goal and I failed miserably and disappointed Dave Feldberg by only paying 1st Place $490. He may never play in Spokane again, although I hope some day he will. I like you only had 15 or 16 Pro Open players.

Anyone that has run a big money tournament knows that you need over 40 Pro Open competitors, paying $80 each and at least $1750 added to the Pro Open division to make 1st Place worth a $1000.

It would seem to me that the Pro Open competitors would also know that you can't have a $1000 1st place prize with 16 competitors paying $50 to play. That's only $752 paid into the purse by the players themselves. As the TD you would have to come up with and additional $4,010 added cash to make 1st Place worth $1000. And that's only the one division, added cash has to be spread across all the pro dividions.

KP35, I think that you did an excellent job running your first PDGA event. I've never been to a tournament where they take you to the bar and buy drinks. Or had free camping, or had Bavarian music played. I believe that a great time was had by 99% of the people.

Oh, and one other thing, there not supposed to be any whining in disc golf!! If all disc golfers would remember this one fact every tournament would be fun for all.

So you'll just have to understand that people will be disappointed even when you run a great tournament and that most disc golfers have no idea what it takes to put together a sanctioned PDGA event, God Bless Them.

Remember that these Forums are just a whipping post or maybe a whining post for the unhappy players as well as place for Thank you post or atta boy post for the happy players. Most of the people who post on these sites hide behind an avatar.

So Kevin, don't get caught up in everyone else's negativity. And for sure don't listen to Sam's B#LL SH*T because I'm sure that he or she hasn't taken the time to get to know you and could care less about anything you accomplished or how you feel.

If you look at the emoticons, you'll see an almost exact representation of all the folks who come to a disc golf tournament. As the TD you should be this one and let those that want to be this one be the one they want to be.

And that's my two cents for what it's worth. Which ain't much these days.

[Sam]

Man... why haven't I been to a Washington tournament (that was not at the Mudd) in over 3 years? Oh yeah... this would be one of the major reasons why right here.

[Scott]

Nominated for post of the year. I put my favorite parts, which were many, in bold.

Well done, Bob.

Originally Posted by Wobbly Bob

Hey KP35, the same thing happened the first tournament I ran. It was the Inaugural Lilac City Open in Spokane. There was a statement made by ??someone?? that we were gonna pay 1st place a $$GRAND$$. That was my goal and I failed miserably and disappointed Dave Feldberg by only paying 1st Place $490. He may never play in Spokane again, although I hope some day he will. I like you only had 15 or 16 Pro Open players.

Anyone that has run a big money tournament knows that you need over 40 Pro Open competitors, paying $80 each and at least $1750 added to the Pro Open division to make 1st Place worth a $1000.

It would seem to me that the Pro Open competitors would also know that you can't have a $1000 1st place prize with 16 competitors paying $50 to play. That's only $752 paid into the purse by the players themselves. As the TD you would have to come up with and additional $4,010 added cash to make 1st Place worth $1000. And that's only the one division, added cash has to be spread across all the pro dividions.

KP35, I think that you did an excellent job running your first PDGA event. I've never been to a tournament where they take you to the bar and buy drinks. Or had free camping, or had Bavarian music played. I believe that a great time was had by 99% of the people.

Oh, and one other thing, there not supposed to be any whining in disc golf!! If all disc golfers would remember this one fact every tournament would be fun for all.

So you'll just have to understand that people will be disappointed even when you run a great tournament and that most disc golfers have no idea what it takes to put together a sanctioned PDGA event, God Bless Them.

Remember that these Forums are just a whipping post or maybe a whining post for the unhappy players as well as place for Thank you post or atta boy post for the happy players. Most of the people who post on these sites hide behind an avatar.

So Kevin, don't get caught up in everyone else's negativity. And for sure don't listen to Sam's B#LL SH*T because I'm sure that he or she hasn't taken the time to get to know you and could care less about anything you accomplished or how you feel.

If you look at the emoticons, you'll see an almost exact representation of all the folks who come to a disc golf tournament. As the TD you should be this one and let those that want to be this one be the one they want to be.

And that's my two cents for what it's worth. Which ain't much these days.

[Tim]

Jeez. Is it just me or have things been blown WAY out of proportion here? It sounds to me that nearly everyone had a great time at this tournament, and that some of the pros just were disappointed that they didn't get as much as they were expecting. I don't get the impression that the TDs were claiming that the payout was going to be as large as the pros were expecting, but that the buzz hyped it up from being a "goal" to being a "guarantee". It's unfortunate that expectations got higher than the reality, but come on, lets keep things in perspective...$500+ for 1st place in a B-tier is a lot higher than most tournaments you'll find. Heck, look at GNO, one of the premier events in OR, right? And has been for many years. There was a field 3 times the size of FZD's and 1st place barely cracked $400. I'm not knocking GNO, just pointing out that to get the payout where it was for FZD took a huge amount of added cash--and all for a 1st ever event by newer TDs.

I wish I could have made it out there myself, it sounds like it was a great time. I would just suggest that in the future, keep your goals high, but keep them private, the rumor mill can be a formidable opponent.

[Wobbly Bob]

Amen to that part about the RUMOR MILL!!

[Sam]

I think that the response to the expression of disappointment set me off more than anything else. Like... it's not OK to express it for some reason?

I don't think that the winner of the GNO was disappointed with the payout because I don't think that the payout was advertised to be twice what it turned out to be.

[ChUcK]

I think an overlooked highlight of Kevin's post was the fact that Barsby wasn't promised anything.

Thanks, Snap, I grew up in Auburn and know the area quite well.

[Sam]

And yet... Barsby felt like he was. What's weird to me is that it doesn't seem that Washington TDs care all that much if they piss off touring pros by not meeting the expectations they set. Kind of seems like they do not care if they come back or not nor care about the reputation they will get when these touring pros talk to other touring pros.

Lastly, there were even earlier posts commenting on the size of the advertised payout and how it fell short of what was put out there. Funny how that is now being swept under the rug.

[Tim]

Originally Posted by Sam

I don't think that the winner of the GNO was disappointed with the payout because I don't think that the payout was advertised to be twice what it turned out to be.

That's just the thing though. I don't think it WAS advertised to be twice what it turned out to be. I'd heard that there was going to be a bunch of added cash, but never heard that there was going to be a "guaranteed $1000 to first place" or anything like that. If it had stated something along those lines on the flier, but then didn't meet that, then yes, that would be something to complain about. I don't think anything was advertised as such though...only that there was going to be $4000 of added cash. Sounds to me that the TDs wanted to be able to pay out $1000 to 1st, somebody caught wind of that, and somewhere in the mix that got interpreted to the DG community that yes, they would pay out $1000 to 1st.

[Sam]

But it clearly was advertised as being higher than it turned out to be, right? I don't think Nate Sexton made that up. I also don't think Chris Fry was making something up by saying it was lower than advertised. Do you?

I think that we agree that the TD made a BIG mistake by setting expectations this high - even if that was not his intention to do so. Had he simply said, "whoops! My bad" the whole thing would have been forgiven and done, I am sure. Instead, there is the implication that Barsby is lying and whining about something unreasonable and that is a completely dick move on the TD's part, in my opinion.