Water Hazard - It Means Your Disc is Not Your Disc Anymore - Dabney State Park

Sam · #1 July 24th, 2009, 08:35 AM

Playing hole 2 Wednesday night, I see a guy in the pond. We ask if we can play through and they say that they are not playing and to go ahead. We throw our drives and proceed to walk to the basket. The guy's woman was sitting next to the bank of the pond with a box full of discs and a sign that says, "Discs, $5 Each".

I ask the woman if they sell everything they find in the pond. She responds yes. I then ask her about discs that come out of there with names and numbers on them. At first she is like, "Yeah... we return those discs." I said good and she says, "Well... except for the ones we find in here. We call on everything else we find but not the ones we find here. Those we sell. Water hazard."

I say, "water hazard? What do you mean?" She responds with, "If they lost it in the water and didn't go and get it, they don't own the disc anymore."

I swear... I almost said, "Brian... is that you? Why are you dressed up like a woman?"

I didn't. Instead, I said, "Well, what if they tried to look for it and couldn't find it? Or, what if they had intended to come back and get it later?"

She replied, "Water hazard. Those discs are ours now since we took the time to go and get them."

I could see it was about to get ugly so I said, "Well, I think you should do what you can to return people's property to them regardless of where you find it" and just walked away.

So... someone might want to alert the rangers the next time these jerks are out there.

Adam Schneider · #2 July 24th, 2009, 08:48 AM

Crap on a cracker.

erp · #3 July 24th, 2009, 09:58 AM

You should have taken their picture and told the rangers or better yet the state police when they make their occasional patrols - not sure about the law here, but my take on it is that they were selling stolen property...probably didn't have a concessionaire's license with the park either.

We should just start a thread on here of douche-like behavior and photograph the people doing it...nothing dampens their enthusiasm like people knowing what they're up to...

Vector_2008 · #4 July 24th, 2009, 10:23 AM

I really don't hear much about discs lost in the pond at Dabney.
How many does everyone think are in that pond on a monthly basis?

Maybe if someone meets this couple again they can gets some names or a license plate and car description. If you are real smooth talker someone might be able to get a phone number. The internet is great place to advertise the names of thieves in the local area.

Sam · #5 July 24th, 2009, 10:36 AM

Somehow, I don't think that they would have posed for a picture.

erp · #6 July 24th, 2009, 11:02 AM

They were sitting behind a sign that said discs, $5 - they were already posing.

You don't need to ask for smiles...just turn your back, get the camera ready, spin and shoot.

Instant, candid shot for the rogues gallery.

Hope they're out there tonight!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sam

Somehow, I don't think that they would have posed for a picture.

Sam · #7 July 24th, 2009, 11:47 AM

I am guessing they will be. It almost seemed like they had set up shop... Walkout from the 2 pad to the basket going left.

Adam Schneider · #8 July 24th, 2009, 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sam

I am guessing they will be. It almost seemed like they had set up shop... Walkout from the 2 pad to the basket going left.

By the bridge, you mean?

erp · #9 July 24th, 2009, 12:44 PM

Film at 11 - I'll bring my camera with the movie mode...

Sam · #10 July 24th, 2009, 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adam Schneider

By the bridge, you mean?

Between the two bridges, I think. Maybe they live under one of them. I don't know...

Harpua_OR · #11 July 24th, 2009, 04:12 PM

I was at next adventure today and noticed their used bins were overflowing. After a closer look most of the discs apperaed to have come from what I though might have been trojan. Many with the discolored look of muddy waters and others with dirt or mud that had dried onto the discs without being wiped clean. Your friends may have offed their loot at next adventure.

ryanajanes · #12 July 24th, 2009, 04:13 PM

bring a big group of guys, and just take all their discs. they will think twice about it next time, if they lost all the work they put in. after all, stealing something that is stolen for the purpose of returning isnt wrong.

erp · #13 July 24th, 2009, 04:32 PM

March them right over to the found disc bin and dump 'em in...unless they're yours - or my blue Rose City Boss...

Eric Olson · #14 August 12th, 2009, 08:14 PM

I saw the pair in question at Dabney in the last week or two. It's a sketchy enterprise they have going, for sure, but they looked like they needed the money more than I would need a disc that I lost.

Secondbest · #15 April 4th, 2010, 02:03 PM

they need to start an award system, i lived in san diego for 5 years and playing at morley field they have a 1$ reward from the pro shop for and found discs, then the pro shop calls u and then u have 30 days to pick it up before the pro shop turns it into a rental, 1$ to get ur lost disc back is not bad at all lol, all i know is every disc i lost at morley field, i got a phone call and got it back for a $buck, iv lost about 3 times more discs at dabney and i have not got one back.

Alexplz · #16 April 30th, 2013, 10:10 PM

Sorry if I'm playing thread necromancer, but...

It sounds like these folks made the trip to fish some discs out of the water. Not only that but the dude was wading (swimming? DIVING?) in that dirty stormdrain of a water hazard in order to retrieve said plastic. If they find discs and decide to keep them or in turn sell them I say good for them - way to show some gumption.

If I find a disc with a # on it on a path or in a bush somewhere I'll call because that's what I'd expect anyone else stumbling upon my disc to do. When I scribble my name and # on a disc I think to myself "why not - worth a shot." If I wing the thing into a pond I don't expect some Captain Save-A-Ho to dive in and get it for me.

What I'm getting at is when a disc goes in the drink IT MEANS IT'S NOT YOURS ANYMORE unless YOU are willing to dive in for it. The disc for all intents and purposes becomes litter. It would have stayed at the bottom of the pond for millenia unless someone went in to grab it.

Scott · #17 May 1st, 2013, 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alexplz

What I'm getting at is when a disc goes in the drink IT MEANS IT'S NOT YOURS ANYMORE unless YOU are willing to dive in for it. The disc for all intents and purposes becomes litter. It would have stayed at the bottom of the pond for millenia unless someone went in to grab it.

This simply not true in the eyes of the law (in Oregon, at least).
I've asked several police officers this question and always receive the same answer - Just because you find something does not make it yours, regardless of where you found it or the effort you had to expend to get it. In other words, "Finders Keepers" is not a valid legal argument.

Furthermore, writing your name and number on a disc provides a reasonable expectation that the property will/should be returned to you if lost. In other words, the "I found it - didn't know they wanted it back" defense has no merit.

afroflow · #18 May 3rd, 2013, 03:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott

This simply not true in the eyes of the law (in Oregon, at least).
I've asked several police officers this question and always receive the same answer - Just because you find something does not make it yours, regardless of where you found it or the effort you had to expend to get it. In other words, "Finders Keepers" is not a valid legal argument.

Furthermore, writing your name and number on a disc provides a reasonable expectation that the property will/should be returned to you if lost. In other words, the "I found it - didn't know they wanted it back" defense has no merit.

With all the cops out there checking photo ID and cross referencing name/number with every tossed disc I'm surprised these disc "thieves" still exist!

Regardless of your very specific (and credited) knowledge of Oregon's finders keepers law, I have to mostly agree with the poster Alexplz. May I suggest that not every disc found falls into the need to return category?

I go above and beyond to get a disc back to it's rightful owner knowing that most discs are worth more then their monetary value of around $15.99. However if you leave a disc behind because the cost of retrieving it out weighs your comfort, you have forfeit ownership of that disc.
IE Playing anywhere from late fall - early spring and your disc lands 5 feet from shore in plain sight, the water is freezing cold. The disc might not be worth the cost of you feeling cold and wet for hours to retrieve it. It is to someone else; they have a new disc.
If I lose my go-to driver, I will stop at nothing to get it back.

Same goes for the Dabney cesspool of a hazard on hole 2. If there's a chance you'll end up in it, maybe throw a disc you found during winter 5 ft off the shore. If you lose a disc in there and you decide to swim around for any amount of time, chances are you'll find 10+ discs that you can happily keep! But realize that the discs came at a cost, you've just contracted a fatal blood parasite. You have approximately 4 weeks to live. My condolences.

As all things that aren't as black and white as they seem, there are still exceptions to my argument. The most responsible thing you can do with found or lost discs is post/regularly check the lost and found section on this forum. If you find a disc in water in plain site, someone may have posted that it was lost up stream and searched endlessly. Use your best judgement.

TL;DR A whole bunch of snark, plus the idea that if a disc is found in water, 999/1000 it was left without due effort to be retrieved by it's owner(please reference your nwdiscgolfnews lost and found subsection to verify). The disc now belongs to you. Return it, don't, your choice. Just know ...Oregon police are watching...

motordisc13 · #19 May 3rd, 2013, 12:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by afroflow

With all the cops out there checking photo ID and cross referencing name/number with every tossed disc I'm surprised these disc "thieves" still exist!

Regardless of your very specific (and credited) knowledge of Oregon's finders keepers law, I have to mostly agree with the poster Alexplz. May I suggest that not every disc found falls into the need to return category?

I go above and beyond to get a disc back to it's rightful owner knowing that most discs are worth more then their monetary value of around $15.99. However if you leave a disc behind because the cost of retrieving it out weighs your comfort, you have forfeit ownership of that disc.
IE Playing anywhere from late fall - early spring and your disc lands 5 feet from shore in plain sight, the water is freezing cold. The disc might not be worth the cost of you feeling cold and wet for hours to retrieve it. It is to someone else; they have a new disc.
If I lose my go-to driver, I will stop at nothing to get it back.

Same goes for the Dabney cesspool of a hazard on hole 2. If there's a chance you'll end up in it, maybe throw a disc you found during winter 5 ft off the shore. If you lose a disc in there and you decide to swim around for any amount of time, chances are you'll find 10+ discs that you can happily keep! But realize that the discs came at a cost, you've just contracted a fatal blood parasite. You have approximately 4 weeks to live. My condolences.

As all things that aren't as black and white as they seem, there are still exceptions to my argument. The most responsible thing you can do with found or lost discs is post/regularly check the lost and found section on this forum. If you find a disc in water in plain site, someone may have posted that it was lost up stream and searched endlessly. Use your best judgement.

TL;DR A whole bunch of snark, plus the idea that if a disc is found in water, 999/1000 it was left without due effort to be retrieved by it's owner(please reference your nwdiscgolfnews lost and found subsection to verify). The disc now belongs to you. Return it, don't, your choice. Just know ...Oregon police are watching...

Maybe the best post I've read.
Ever.
I started off years back with the idea "If I find it, its mine." Over time I realized the joy associated with reuniting plastic with long lost owners... most of the time. Ive gone out of my way to send discs back to owners on my own dime, usually with a happy warm feeling as a result. Usually you'll get a "Thanks for the call, but go ahead and keep it". I once had a fella (erp) surprise me with a Super Roc and a $20 with a "stay cool" note attached.

I did have one experience where I was talking to an owner on the phone (who recently posted in this string. Hmm...) and realized i actually had several of their discs. While trying to get an address to send the discs (on my own dime) I quickly got the impression I was keeping the guy from something more pressing as he was like "Uh-huh, yeah...look, man I gotta get off here, I have friends over." No "thanks" or similar generic niceties. Never heard a peep after sending 4 discs (yes, on my own dime) to his front door. Assumed the best like maybe he neglected to get my #. Wait, no. I sent that with the discs... Oh, well.
I personally never expect to get plastic back... only because out of the 50+ discs I have lost at Trojan, I have received (0) phone calls. Not a big deal. I only ask the new owners to leave my ink in it, so when they lose it, I stand a slim chance to be reunited.... lol.
So, life goes on. Oh, and as long as your name doesn't rhyme with Schmott Schmill rest assured I will happily call # in found disc. And,yes, return on my own dime.

ryanajanes · #20 May 4th, 2013, 01:38 AM

i call on every disc everytime. if everyone did, disc golf would be better. simple. doesnt matter where the disc is. i have gone in at dabney and called people, i have gone in at trojan and called people, and rooster rock, and mciver. even if i find ones with no name i post them here.