Add Alternate Pin Placements.

[roadhog]

be glad to help. when and where to meet let me know.

[catalystdg]

we will start digging fri around 10ish and sat around 9 ish nov 13 and 14

[General Scales]

Originally Posted by Parks

I never said that.

You said you liked playing some of the short holes with your kids at High Bridge because they could birdie them, so I was making sure that you knew there were other courses in the area with short holes. Filtering people to courses that match their skill level is a win for everyone.

Also, my favorite hole at High Bridge is a short hole (#17, it combines aesthetic appeal with multiple fair routes, and a good scoring range), and I think that some of the shorter holes play really well (#5, its a tough landing zone to control, although it is deuce or die).

That being said, I think that High Bridge and Downriver are fairly redundant. The SSA of each course is 48, give or take a stroke. I would like to see one of them get a more challenging layout. Challenging doesn't necessarily equate with long, as catalystdg pointed out.

Also, putting in a new course is actually pretty difficult. We always seem to be able to get some interest from the city/park/whoever and yet new courses never get put in.

As a final note, pretend that every hole at High Bridge remained exactly the same but had 200 feet added to it (obviously not possible, just make believe). Wouldn't you just start 200 feet closer to the pin if your family or group were just beginners? It wouldn't hurt your experience in any way.

Amen to that. I'm not saying make every hole at Highbridge 500 plus feet. That would be retarded. My favorite hole out there is 18 and that is longer but because of the elevation change is reachable by most with a solid drive. I get there with a Buzzz. I'm saying it would be nice to have all the holes have an a and b setup. That way the whole of Spokane isn't playing the same 18 hole over and over.

[General Scales]

Originally Posted by catalystdg

we will start digging fri around 10ish and sat around 9 ish nov 13 and 14

I'll try and make it down there Saturday to help with whatever needs it. I won't be out of work on Saturday till noon but I'll fly down there to help.

So if I'm understanding correctly Highbridge is going to become a 36? Does that mean like 18 north and 18 south like say Lakewood or Steliacom. Or is it going to be one continuous loop? That would be epic. Plus does this mean that some of the Chump Challenge 2009 holes are going to become permanent? I sure hope so!!!!

[catalystdg]

bring shovels if anyone has a wheelbarrow, 5 gallon buckets. or some spare 2x4s or 4x4s let me know
again 10 am fri nov 13, 9am sat nov 14
thanks

[Eric whippet Brown]

I will bring my camera down tomorrow for the 2nd round of us clearing out fairways and greens, there are some fun new holes that make it more of a challenge which is good Thanks to everyone that came out and hope to see more on Sat.

[General Scales]

So you guys added nine new pins and poles yesterday? Woohoo!!! How do they play with the existing 18 hole and where in the layout were they added?
Are they any of the chump challenge holes?

[Stimpi]

New anchors for most/all of the holes at High Bridge are in concrete, and the baskets will be moved over this week, nine at a time. Some of the holes play harder and a few of them play easier, some play nearly the same but you might finish left instead of right or vice versa. I think the "family fun" value will still be high. None of the new placements are unreasonable, just different, like you might move a hole around on a golf green.
There are 9 new holes scoped out on the west side of A street, starting down by the Riverside, A street, Park Road intersection, and finishes up near the current #11 tee. Most of the anchors are in, but no teepads are built yet. More to come soon.

[Evil T]

Was out there playing today and saw a bunch of the new pin placements, and some of the new holes across the street. I like most of them, but I really like that someone is doing something. If you need help again just leave another post here. Would be cool to find a group in town that's more active. If not maybe I'll go put stairs down on six. Been saying that for years. There's bricks everywhere to do it. Damn it.

[Parks]

Originally Posted by Evil T

Was out there playing today and saw a bunch of the new pin placements, and some of the new holes across the street. I like most of them, but I really like that someone is doing something. If you need help again just leave another post here. Would be cool to find a group in town that's more active. If not maybe I'll go put stairs down on six. Been saying that for years. There's bricks everywhere to do it. Damn it.

Don't bother. My understanding is that 5 and 6 will need their teepads changed eventually since they play across the street.

You would want to talk to catalystdg, but if anywhere needs stairs it would be up to the alt teepad for hole 12. The slick paint on concrete for its current pad isn't that safe, and there are some trees that need trimming for the lower tee that wouldn't affect the upper tee.

[Wobbly Bob]

There was a Spokane Park Board meeting last week that Jeff & Gordy attended. It was stated by Parks the we were not to proceed with the new Creekside Nine at this time. We were however given the Okay for the Nine across A Street. How many second pin positions were installed on the existing course? I want to update the website.

[catalystdg]

there are 7 anchors across "a" street we will have 4 baskets and 5 buckets or tone poles untill spring. if anyone wants to help out let me know, we need to start work on the teepads (just leveling them out)
half the baskets will be moved today and they will be rotated every month or so
thanks go out to everone that helped out.
joe, troy, lyle, eric, shad(and his kids) kevin, tim, cole, christian, shawna, thorton, jeff, and i'm sure there are some i missed
its great to see something happening again its been way to long

[Evil T]

Originally Posted by catalystdg

there are 7 anchors across "a" street we will have 4 baskets and 5 buckets or tone poles untill spring. if anyone wants to help out let me know, we need to start work on the teepads (just leveling them out)
half the baskets will be moved today and they will be rotated every month or so
thanks go out to everone that helped out.
joe, troy, lyle, eric, shad(and his kids) kevin, tim, cole, christian, shawna, thorton, jeff, and i'm sure there are some i missed
its great to see something happening again its been way to long

Just post when you need help. If I'm not working I'll try to be there.

[Parks]

First off, I want to thank Christopher and Jeremy for planning out the alt pins and the holes across A Street, and I want to thank the club for moving forward with it.

My synopsis of the new pins:

Hole 1, 50' past normal pin. I didn't like this at first as I didn't think it changed the shot enough, but playing to the anchor today it does play quit a bit differently. I had to disc up to a driver and throw a big anny, and couldn't reach it with a thumber. The trees definitely make it a different style shot.

Hole 2, pin straight and at tree line of 17's fairway. I like this one, its nothing special really but there isn't really anywhere else to put this pin. It changes the shot and makes it a little less technical for lefties/sidearm throwers. It seems more about range control than anything else now.

Hole 3, pin off to the right on the point in the woods. This pin is fantastic, I think it is very challenging but rewards good drive/upshot placement. There is risk/reward in going for the birdie on this one with the hairy green. You will definitely see scoring variation on this hole in tournaments.

Hole 4, pin off to the left about 50 feet into the woods. This is one of two pins that I'm not a fan of. I think its in the dreaded par 3.5 category. It is possible to bird with a decent amount of power for righties, but lefties don't really have a chance at bird without some ridiculous shot. I think pushing this pin back into the woods another 100 feet or so would make it a nice, fair par 4 where you had to make two well-placed shots for a 3. You could make a single moderate screw-up and get a par 4, and anything beyond that would be bogeyville. I just don't see much scoring variation happening on this hole.

Hole 5, pin 80' to the left of the current pin and down a bit. I like this pin, it requires a tougher shot to birdie than the normal pin, but is still reachable by anyone. There is a righty hyzer route, but it requires good execution to birdie that way. I think this balances out the slight lefty/sidearm bias of the normal pin. As an added bonus, this pin plays the route along path in the alternate old teepad placement for 5. This will come into play if the teepads for 5 and 6 ever get moved across the street.

Hole 6, pin to the right 100' and beyond the treeline. This was the other pin I wasn't a big fan of. I think the routes to the pin are pretty lucky, and you'll see a lot of boring 3's on this hole. All one has to do is avoid the right side of the fairway and its a 3 every time. That being said, I don't really know of a spot for an alt on this hole that changes the shot and makes for an exciting hole.

Hole 7, pin straight down the right side route. I like this pin, as it requires a straight shot through a fair opening. I'm thinking the some of the brush behind the basket should be cleared in order to punish ace runs that are too aggressive by not stopping them, as well as to make a decent size green for this one.

Hole 8, no alt pin. Possibly an alt teepad in the future, a little ways back into the clearing behind the current pad? That would add a some much needed difficulty to this hole.

Hole 9, alt pin back and to the left about 60 feet. I really like this pin placement. There is actually some risk to the hole now, and it requires hitting a good line for birdie.

Hole 10, alt pin back and to the right about 80 feet. This pin might be my favorite. You have to place your drive, then control your upshot onto the hairy green. There is risk reward, as trying to park your drive can leave you with a nasty upshot, and running long birdie putts can leave you without a return putts. A bad drive is punished with a much harder upshot, but a great approach can still save a 3. You will definitely see scoring variation on this hole in tournaments.

Hole 11, alt pin to the left of the road, about as deep as normal pin. I like this one. Its about range control. Too shallow, too deep, or too far left and you don't have a putt, but there is a large, fair green that rewards good drives with a good birdie opportunity.

Hole 12, alt pin to the left 100' and a little deeper. Its a little tougher to hit the right line than the normal placement. A bit righty favoring, while the normal pin has a bit of a lefty bias. Not much else to say.

Hole 13, alt pin through the new fairway on right side. This hole is sweet. You have to play the tunnel, and there are good routes at the end for righties and lefties. For righties, its a gentle hyzer-flip that comes back, and for lefties its a flat hyzer that fades late. This reminds me of hole 6 on the Porcupine course but plays more fairly. I would even go so far as to suggest that there be another alt pin placement added to the left and we could stop using the old pin altogether.

Hole 14, pin on the bump to the left of the path leading to the normal pin. I'm still a bit undecided on this one. I think the normal pin is great since you have to play golf on it if you don't have the power to reach it, and it requires you to hit your line very well to birdie it. This pin on the other hand is a very easy three, and birdieing it just requires a decent amount of power without much care for the lines you use to get there. I guess how I end up feeling on this one will be based on how hard it is to play the green.

Hole 15, alt pin is 3's normal pin. This is a good one. It requires hitting a late gap, and its unwise to overdrive this hole. [edit]This is not the official alt, I forget who told me it was. There currently isn't an alt for 15.[/edit]

Hole 16, alt pin is straighter and deeper than the normal pin. This one is fun, it requires a long, somewhat straight drive to birdie. Can easily leave you with a 4 if your drive is poorly placed. It plays sort of like Hawk 4 in this position. This one will probably have a good scoring range in tournaments.

Hole 17, alt pin is 50 feet to the right of the current position. This one forces you to throw a straighter shot than the other position, but is more forgiving of skips from shots that hyzer in.

Hole 18, no alt pin. I don't see a good place for an alt pin on this one. There could be a good place for an alt teepad, but safety could be an issue.

[General Scales]

Thank you for the update on all the new pins. I love the sound of 13's new route. Definitely going to hit it up on Saturday afternoon.

Are the baskets going to rotate on a monthly basis say like Cherry Hill or Corbin? Or is it going to be a move half the baskets and half the next month to keep the new layouts fresh as humanly possible?

Either way I'm frickin stoked that something has been done to modify the course.

[Eric whippet Brown]

The idea of alt 15 in 3's pin location I think is going to be a big problem with people playing hole 3. If your drive (rhbh) off 15 went straight and didn't hyzer out it would go for 3's alt and throwing (lhbh) could drive into 3's fairway there. plus the fact that people will probably play 15's alt from 3's tee like it was normal 3? We should try to get some sort of alt tee's signs up soon so we can stop any confusion out there now. But all in all it is fun to play a different layout. Played it 3 times now and have only posted a 5 down so far, I think I will go play it tomorrow.

[catalystdg]

alt hole 15 does not play to 3's basket. (if this is the way its set up please let me know)
hole 15 does not have an alt pin at this time.
hole 5 and 6 teepads will be moved so they will no longer be throwing over the road. hole 1 could potentialy be moved as well if the telephone pole gets hit very often.

[General Scales]

So are all the baskets that have alt pins moved at this time? If not which ones are so I can play them accordingly when I head there tomorrow.

Also, the new nine at A street, any tee markings?

[catalystdg]

went down and played today trying to iron out what will be the a and b placements and i should have a map ready soon.
hole 4 is probably one of my favorite holes on the course and once it gets thinned out a little it will play a lot better for the biginner level players, right now if you can throw 275 -325 straight and a 100 -125 ft upshot its a easy par but if you try to hyzer( rhbh) of the tee and you cant throw a 425 ft hyzer you will bogey or worse, its actually an almost exact mirror of new 10 ( just a little thicker with small trees)
also got some good news and bad news... we will not have the holes we just put in across "a" street but we will be able to use all of peoples park and the area between riverside, gov. way and the creek.

[Timber]

What happened? I thought Parks and Rec was on board for A Street.