Question to all golfers and TDs!?

[Yoduh]

If a female breaks her arm and informs the TD 12 days before the event happens than what should happen?
A. The TD refunds her money
B. The TD keeps half of her entry
C. The TD keeps all of her entry

[LegoRules]

Originally Posted by Yoduh

If a female breaks her arm and informs the TD 12 days before the event happens than what should happen?
A. The TD refunds her money
B. The TD keeps half of her entry
C. The TD keeps all of her entry

From the PDGA website:

1.3 Withdraws and Refunds

A. A player may officially withdraw only by contacting the Tournament Director.

B. Players must email or phone their withdrawals to the Tournament Director only at the contact information posted.

C. Discussions with persons other than the Tournament Director, including other tournament staff, shall not be considered official.

D. No refunds will be issued after the 7th day prior to the start of the event, but the player shall be sent a player’s package if one was provided to event competitors.

E. Withdrawals made before the 7th day prior to the start of the event shall receive a 50% refund.

F. Withdrawals made 14 days prior to the start of the event shall be refunded 100 %, less postage and handling, which shall not exceed 10% of the entry fee.

G. These criteria may be relaxed at the discretion of the Tournament Director.


If it were my event I would refund her money.

[Scott]

Originally Posted by LegoRules

From the PDGA website:

1.3 Withdraws and Refunds

A. A player may officially withdraw only by contacting the Tournament Director.

B. Players must email or phone their withdrawals to the Tournament Director only at the contact information posted.

C. Discussions with persons other than the Tournament Director, including other tournament staff, shall not be considered official.

D. No refunds will be issued after the 7th day prior to the start of the event, but the player shall be sent a player’s package if one was provided to event competitors.

E. Withdrawals made before the 7th day prior to the start of the event shall receive a 50% refund.

F. Withdrawals made 14 days prior to the start of the event shall be refunded 100 %, less postage and handling, which shall not exceed 10% of the entry fee.

G. These criteria may be relaxed at the discretion of the Tournament Director.


If it were my event I would refund her money.

Agreed.

[LJ Jubner]

Originally Posted by Yoduh

If a female breaks her arm and informs the TD 12 days before the event happens than what should happen?
A. The TD refunds her money
B. The TD keeps half of her entry
C. The TD keeps all of her entry

So what if the player asks the TD (after HER ARM IS BROKEN) if she can play with her off hand (as late as Wed)? plays both Sat rounds then DNF's on Sunday. WE won't Talk about her being an open player or the fact she slowed not just her division but both Sat Rounds


the pDGA said that if she played and did not want to use her rating she could play as a non competitive participant.


As a TD I should be able to say to this player "why not just sit out the weekend and make room for someone who will actually show on Sunday"

[Yoduh]

Originally Posted by LJ Jubner

So what if the player asks the TD (after HER ARM IS BROKEN) if she can play with her off hand (as late as Wed)? plays both Sat rounds then DNF's on Sunday. WE won't Talk about her being an open player or the fact she slowed not just her division but both Sat Rounds


the pDGA said that if she played and did not want to use her rating she could play as a non competitive participant.


As a TD I should be able to say to this player "why not just sit out the weekend and make room for someone who will actually show on Sunday"

I am asking a very specific question Jub. Read it again if you don't understand. It has nothing to do with something that has happened and held up a tourney that has been played.
The situation u are referring to the player showed up and played Sunday and played until 6 holes remained. She was in tears from the excruciating pain. Speaking with other women she played with she in fact played very quickly and was not even the slowest in the group.
I am talking about an event that has yet to be played.

[TreeLove]

Originally Posted by Yoduh

If a female breaks her arm and informs the TD 12 days before the event happens than what should happen?
A. The TD refunds her money
B. The TD keeps half of her entry
C. The TD keeps all of her entry

What is the relevance of the player's gender? If you plan on handling it differently than you would if the player were male, I would strongly encourage you to reconsider.

[Sausage Fingers]

Originally Posted by TreeLove

What is the relevance of the player's gender? If you plan on handling it differently than you would if the player were male, I would strongly encourage you to reconsider.

Yeah! Gender should not come into this decision. We all want to play on a level playing field...so to speak.

I had to answer B due to the fact that the 14 day window had passed but the 7 day window had not. I usually look to the PDGA rules when deciding how to deal with certain situations. Now if the tourney is NOT PDGA sanctioned, then I would probably go with A and ignore the gender of the player completely. Also, the reason why the player wants/needs to withdraw should not make a difference.

[ScottW]

I am familiar with the PDGA rules on this kind of situation and given the severity of the injury, appropriate excuse, and reasonable time fram for notification I would probably give a full refund less shipping expenses (maybe less player pack expenses) but would certainly give the benefit of the doubt. I would not feel compelled to stick to the PDGA guidelines as these are only guidelines. Just my 2 cents.

[ericedge]

My personal policy for events that I run is almost always to give a 100% refund (- online reg fee). One exception to that policy is when a player no-shows and leaves an open spot on a card, especially when someone could have been added from the wait list!

Some of my reasoning for such a generous policy...
1. I figure players want to participate so if they have to bail it's probably for a legit reason. Along as I have time to adjust the payout it's no big deal to me.
2. I want to give players every incentive possible to pre-register as early as possible. If the threat of losing all or part of your entry fee is hanging over you then why sign up ahead of time?
3. I consider the Disc Golf community as a big group of friends. I figure if I go out of my way to make the whole process of being a part of an event a positive experience then that karma will come around full circle in the long run. So far that's largely been the case!

Every TD has different feelings about this issue of course. As long as PDGA guidelines are being met (at a minimum) then it comes down to how the player feels they were treated and whether or not they want to play another event run by that TD. The Golden Rule applies here from both sides.

It should go without saying that communication is king. Players, please let the TD know if you can't make it to the event, no matter what the reason is, it really does help!

[Lyounger]

I guess the guidlines are just that due to so many possible variables.

If the tourney is full and someone can fill the spot and keep the $$ relatively close, no biggie.

If the tourney is just scraping by and the TD would have to supplement the tourney with her own $$ due to the withdrawl, that would be undesireable.

If the player has a reputation of being a flake and frequently 'no shows' I would be more apt to enforce the guidelines.


In the hypothetical situation presented I would rather have a 'D.' option which would allow the player to compete in a division that was appropriate to the skill level of playing with the off hand if she wanted to play.

TD decisions are tough....

[Magilla]

Originally Posted by LegoRules

From the PDGA website:

1.3 Withdraws and Refunds

G. These criteria may be relaxed at the discretion of the Tournament Director.

By rule it is up to the TD to follow the PDGA rule if he/she wishes. It sure helps as a backup, if needed.....but the Quoted section allows a TD to treat this rule more as a guideline and be a bit more relaxed in certain cases.

In a case such as a verifiable injury/illness, etc.....a full refund would be certainly justifiable. Unless of course the TD wanted to be an ASS....

[TreeLove]

Typically, when I must withdraw from an event prior to the event date, regardless of reason, I will donate my entry fee, so, assuming the TD applies money to the payout, and adjusts it for fewer players, then the payout actually becomes richer for the remaining players.

I will usually ask if the TD has en extra player pack, if I may still have one, and they usually do.

So that is an option for players to consider when they must withdraw from an event.

[Yoduh]

Originally Posted by ericedge

My personal policy for events that I run is almost always to give a 100% refund (- online reg fee). One exception to that policy is when a player no-shows and leaves an open spot on a card, especially when someone could have been added from the wait list!

Some of my reasoning for such a generous policy...
1. I figure players want to participate so if they have to bail it's probably for a legit reason. Along as I have time to adjust the payout it's no big deal to me.
2. I want to give players every incentive possible to pre-register as early as possible. If the threat of losing all or part of your entry fee is hanging over you then why sign up ahead of time?
3. I consider the Disc Golf community as a big group of friends. I figure if I go out of my way to make the whole process of being a part of an event a positive experience then that karma will come around full circle in the long run. So far that's largely been the case!

Every TD has different feelings about this issue of course. As long as PDGA guidelines are being met (at a minimum) then it comes down to how the player feels they were treated and whether or not they want to play another event run by that TD. The Golden Rule applies here from both sides.

It should go without saying that communication is king. Players, please let the TD know if you can't make it to the event, no matter what the reason is, it really does help!

I AGREE WITH THIS STATEMENT COMPLETELY!! This is $100 entry BTW. It doesn't matter if it were a female or a male. Just happened to be the case which I should not have even stated. ASS, Magilla, in this case, is what I would call the proper pronoun. All those who would keep the money must think that money grows on tree's or they must have plenty of it. This person has not been able to work full time because of this injury.But hey, it's just family. The TD has even told this person that she reminds him so much of her own Grand daughter... sheesh

[Yoduh]

I have heard people talking bad about the TD in a crowded room with others joining in and the player out their money defends the TD and says really nice things. Must be hard to be the man.

[Yoduh]

Originally Posted by LJ Jubner

So what if the player asks the TD (after HER ARM IS BROKEN) if she can play with her off hand (as late as Wed)? plays both Sat rounds then DNF's on Sunday. WE won't Talk about her being an open player or the fact she slowed not just her division but both Sat Rounds


the pDGA said that if she played and did not want to use her rating she could play as a non competitive participant.


As a TD I should be able to say to this player "why not just sit out the weekend and make room for someone who will actually show on Sunday"

Were you even there Jub??How do you know she slowed down her division?? DO you eat pieces of $hit for breakfast?

[sankor76]

Jub are you trying to be mean? You were not at the DRO how could you say anything about what happened? She has never dropped out of a tournament ever before that is why she tried to play. And for saying she is not a pro player and slowed the tournament down, maybe you should look at your own skills and you see that she played rounds rated to what fits with in your own average, also the fact that you have knee braces on and cannot hardly move. Then look at her average round ratings and see the skill difference between you, then talk about pro status. However if you still think you are rite then according to your own logic you should not play.
By the way I don’t thinks the player in question even know that she is being talked about on this forum. So why talk crap? It’s a simple question other people are mad because if they get hurt they want to be able to get a full refund.
Disc golf is about having fun please don’t ruin it for everyone. please just stick to the questions this is not intended as a place to talk crap about someone who has only had nice thing to say about you, but now I guess that she will find out what type of person you really are

[Gordy #21004]

TDs around the world do the work that fills the coffers of the PDGA in return for little or nothing. In comparison to this 'little or nothing' they get in return for all the requirements a TD must meet, the commitment on the part of a professional competitor is nominal; they don't even have to finish the job......The section in the competition manual regarding withdrawals is a procedure that spells out what each parties' responsibilities are. Everyone involved should read and understand these procedures and be prepared to abide or this game will remain in the sandbox.

[LJ Jubner]

Originally Posted by sankor76

Jub are you trying to be mean? You were not at the DRO how could you say anything about what happened? She has never dropped out of a tournament ever before that is why she tried to play. And for saying she is not a pro player and slowed the tournament down,

No, I was not trying to be mean. The entire week before DRO this player (gender and skill not important) and how it could effect the other 94 players who ALSO SIGNED UP. I just don't get it When I am hurt I don't play. Keep my entry fee as sponsorship.

Originally Posted by sankor76

. And for saying she is not a pro player and slowed the tournament down, maybe you should look at your own skills and you see that she played rounds rated to what fits with in your own average, also the fact that you have knee braces on and cannot hardly move. Then look at her average round ratings and see the skill difference between you, then talk about pro status. However if you still think you are rite then according to your own logic you should not play.

I am not a Pro Player never have been never will be! Yes, my knees are bad but they have never kept me from thinking and working for the benefit of others.

Originally Posted by sankor76

By the way I don’t thinks the player in question even know that she is being talked about on this forum. So why talk crap? It’s a simple question other people are mad because if they get hurt they want to be able to get a full refund.

If I wanted to talk crap I would have said her name. So Say your in a soccer league and you break your arm the week before it starts, You have paid your fees do you deserve a full refund of those fees?

Originally Posted by sankor76

Disc golf is about having fun

For as many people possible

[Yoduh]

Originally Posted by Gordy #21004

TDs around the world do the work that fills the coffers of the PDGA in return for little or nothing. In comparison to this 'little or nothing' they get in return for all the requirements a TD must meet, the commitment on the part of a professional competitor is nominal; they don't even have to finish the job......The section in the competition manual regarding withdrawals is a procedure that spells out what each parties' responsibilities are. Everyone involved should read and understand these procedures and be prepared to abide or this game will remain in the sandbox.

G. These criteria may be relaxed at the discretion of the Tournament Director.

[Yoduh]

No reward for a TD means keep players money whenever possible.. When I played the 350 person Beaver State Fling I over heard a player talking to the TD about an hour before the beginning of the event. This player had an knee injury. The TD offered a full refund to the player. To bad they didn't seek any compensation..