Dear Chuck Kennedy, How Do You Call This Putt? Page Title Module
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  • General Scales
    started a topic Dear Chuck Kennedy, How Do You Call This Putt?

    Dear Chuck Kennedy, How Do You Call This Putt?

    The putt has been hanging like this on the basket for 60-90 seconds before the person started video taping. What's the ruling during a tournament? Pretty cool to watch though.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OVdRV...ature=youtu.be

  • Yardbird
    replied
    You can't really compare a "wedged" disc to the "balancing" disc.

    The wedged disc was never in the basket and was a poor putt.

    A balancing disc was in the basket (most likely) and the chains failed at keeping the disc in, for whatever reason. Yes, it was probably true that the putt was not perfectly executed and should not count. The point is that the disc is being supported by the top of the tray not the inside wall.

    Per the rules, a balancing disc is no good. Mark your correct lie and be glad the bad putt didn't roll outside the 10m circle for a harder putt to hole out.

    Rule as it reads: 803.13(B) Disc Entrapment Devices: In order to hole out, the thrower must release the disc and it must come to rest supported by the chains and/or the inner cylinder (bottom and inside wall) of the tray.

    Not that I agree with the rule, but it is needed to clearly define the proper way to hole out for official scoring. IMHO, for recreational play, a disc supported above the bottom of the tray should count as in. Yes, that would include a fair amount of "bad" putts (drot, wedgies, disc hanging outside on nub, etc.)

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  • Chuck Kennedy
    replied
    It doesn't matter. Even if we say the balancing disc is partly supported by the inside of the basket, it's also supported by the "top" and the "outside" of the basket which are locations that technically cannot be part of the support for a disc that has holed out, at least the way the rule is stated. The balancing disc is not much different than a disc wedged halfway in the side of the basket which does not count as in.

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  • mine all mine
    replied
    Originally posted by Chuck Kennedy View Post
    The disc "officially" stopped - balanced on the rail - based on how the rules are interpreted. It later fell in after its position was already fixed as the point under the rail on the ground. A disc balancing on the rail is not in since the disc is not supported by the bottom or inside of the basket per 803.13B.
    The question is still, where does the inside of the basket end? is there a horizontal line that extends from the top of the rail or the nubs, or a vertical line that can be breached by a disc resting on that line? I understand a disc that is hanging on the outside of the basket, but in this instance it is hanging mostly inside the basket

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  • Chuck Kennedy
    replied
    I don't understand why that is not in... It went above the plain of the basket, under the top ring of chains. If it were not wobbling would it be considered in? During team golf this winter we lost a match by 1 stroke because a putt that landed like this was counted in. And I agreed with the ruling.
    The disc "officially" stopped - balanced on the rail - based on how the rules are interpreted. It later fell in after its position was already fixed as the point under the rail on the ground. A disc balancing on the rail is not in since the disc is not supported by the bottom or inside of the basket per 803.13B.

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  • mowens404
    replied
    http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fb...type=1&theater

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  • cefire
    replied
    Originally posted by Chuck Kennedy View Post
    As I pointed out, a disc landing on the target or the playing surface is handled a little differently from a disc landing anywhere else above or below the playing surface. Essentially, a disc lying above or below the playing surface is never "at rest." However, once the player arrives at the disc, its position gets marked on the playing surface even if the disc is moving around. So, it doesn't matter if the group wants to call a player's disc above 2m "at rest" for a penalty right after the player throws it. The player has the right to get to their disc before the final position of the disc is pinned down. That means the disc may fall down before the player gets there and it's played at that point. Of course, it could fall out of the tree and roll OB and that would be where it ends up. So if your disc is in a tree, there's no 2m penalty and there's OB nearby, you might want to hurry to your disc to mark it just in case it might fall out of the tree before you get there.
    Thanks!

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  • mowens404
    replied


    This is what I understand as "hangs outside the tray from one of the nubs." I would not consider our first example as hanging on a nub.






    Tried to upload a picture, but it didn't work. Picture is two posts below.
    Last edited by mowens404; June 29th, 2012, 11:30 AM. Reason: error

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  • mowens404
    replied
    "The definition of holing out has been tightened up a bit. A putt that sticks in the side of the tray, or hangs outside the tray from one of the nubs, no longer counts."
    That putt is not hanging from the nub outside of the tray. It is balanced on the line.

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  • mowens404
    replied
    I don't understand why that is not in... It went above the plain of the basket, under the top ring of chains. If it were not wobbling would it be considered in? During team golf this winter we lost a match by 1 stroke because a putt that landed like this was counted in. And I agreed with the ruling.

    Leave a comment:


  • Chuck Kennedy
    replied
    As I pointed out, a disc landing on the target or the playing surface is handled a little differently from a disc landing anywhere else above or below the playing surface. Essentially, a disc lying above or below the playing surface is never "at rest." However, once the player arrives at the disc, its position gets marked on the playing surface even if the disc is moving around. So, it doesn't matter if the group wants to call a player's disc above 2m "at rest" for a penalty right after the player throws it. The player has the right to get to their disc before the final position of the disc is pinned down. That means the disc may fall down before the player gets there and it's played at that point. Of course, it could fall out of the tree and roll OB and that would be where it ends up. So if your disc is in a tree, there's no 2m penalty and there's OB nearby, you might want to hurry to your disc to mark it just in case it might fall out of the tree before you get there.

    Leave a comment:


  • JNichols
    replied
    Originally posted by cefire View Post
    Thanks Chuck, very interesting!

    Is there a special case then for a disc caught in tree and then falling out of the tree within the specified time limit due to wind? Assuming 2m was called for the tournament of course.
    Chuck Posted under rule 803.03F~"Once the disc has landed in a position based solely on the energy imparted by the thrower, the disc is considered at rest. Further movement from that location due to wind, gravity or water currents do not change the position."

    I would take that as a NO for a Special Case involving the Two Meter Rule. Interested to hear what Chuck has to say on this one!

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  • cefire
    replied
    Thanks Chuck, very interesting!

    Is there a special case then for a disc caught in tree and then falling out of the tree within the specified time limit due to wind? Assuming 2m was called for the tournament of course.

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  • JNichols
    replied
    Chuck to the rescue. Thanks Chuck!

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  • General Scales
    replied
    Thanks Chuck, I'm sure that I'll never see this happen in a tournament but it's nice to have the clarification.

    Leave a comment:

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