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  • Courtesy Violations...

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by snap7times
    ...the other guy who had tons of courtesy violation issues which we were nice enough not to stroke him at all *kabza was more bothered by this since he saw the worse violation of them all*...

    I'm curious about what the courtesy violations were and why you decided not to call them. For another thread, perhaps....

    Now, since someone asked... i'll answer, I won't mention who it was cuz you can see for yourself on the tournament results and I invite both Kabza's to add to anything I missed cuz of course I miss things; especially with the other people on the card chanting "miss, miss, miss" and think I can't hear that heh...

    ok... From what I know and saw from the 3rd round alone.
    1. Very first hole - hole 11, guy picked up his upshot about 8 feet away and didn't putt out. *I didn't see him do this because I was putting down my bag over to the side near 12 tee and I was the closest to the pin so I was going last after everyone putt out, but I did see him make the upshot and know where the disc was, it was not a "automatic" putt, and when i looked back up he was already walking towards tee 12* (Kabza informed me after everything was over for the tournament that he had indeed gave him a verbal warning, which I didn't know and wasn't even sure that he did in deed did not putt out)
    so that was the worse of them all, not even finishing a hole.
    2. Not using a marker for almost all of his shots. I had to give him one of my mini's with like 4 holes left when I finally realized he wasn't using a mini at all.
    *I later learned that another guy had given him a mini earlier which the miniless guy lost on the very next hole*
    3. Anything under 20 feet, he just picked up the disc and putt out with nothing marking his lie.
    4. On the very last hole, the famous hole 10 that tied everything up, the guy was supposed to tee off 3rd, but he just got up there and hurled his tee shot up the hill first. This confused me and before I could confirm that he had tee'd off way out of order, the whole group had tee'd off except me, but at the time, I was thinking I had a 1 stroke lead and was going to par this for the win heh... but the park job during sudden death made the whole tournament way better so...

    In a way we should have been more anal with him, but at the same time, the guy's friends should have taught him the basics instead of us educating him on every little couresty of the game etc... It's easy to talk smack should have, would have, could have, but when the time comes, not alot of people speak up at the right time. Now if I would have known that Kabza did give him a verbal warning on the first hole and that he had been given a mini in the 2nd round and lost it, then I probably would have spoken up immediately... oh well...

  • #2
    What about a time violation? I heard tell of a guy who walked every shot...waited for his turn to throw, then walked almost to the basket, then back to his disc, then he made his shot...on every shot. Isn't there, by pdga rule, a time frame you must make your shot? Is it long enough for a player to walk every shot before throwing? Now I don't throw tourneys, not many anyway, but that would drive me crazy if it were allowed.
    educate your thinking

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by JMan View Post
      What about a time violation? I heard tell of a guy who walked every shot...waited for his turn to throw, then walked almost to the basket, then back to his disc, then he made his shot...on every shot. Isn't there, by pdga rule, a time frame you must make your shot? Is it long enough for a player to walk every shot before throwing? Now I don't throw tourneys, not many anyway, but that would drive me crazy if it were allowed.
      30 seconds

      Comment


      • #4
        Well the gentleman that I heard of was way out of line...
        educate your thinking

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by JMan View Post
          Well the gentleman that I heard of was way out of line...
          So were the people on the card who didn't call him on it.

          801.03 Excessive Time
          A. A maximum of 30 seconds is allowed to each player to make a throw after:

          The previous player has thrown; and,
          The player has taken a reasonable time to arrive at the disc and mark the lie; and,
          The playing area is clear and free of distractions.


          B. A player shall receive a warning for the first excessive time violation if observed by two or more players of the group or an official. The player shall be assessed one penalty throw for each subsequent excessive time violation in the same round if observed by two or more players of the group or an official.

          Comment


          • #6
            Whoa.. Those aren't courtesy violations.
            Originally posted by snap7times View Post
            1. Very first hole - hole 11, guy picked up his upshot about 8 feet away and didn't putt out. *I didn't see him do this because I was putting down my bag over to the side near 12 tee and I was the closest to the pin so I was going last after everyone putt out, but I did see him make the upshot and know where the disc was, it was not a "automatic" putt, and when i looked back up he was already walking towards tee 12* (Kabza informed me after everything was over for the tournament that he had indeed gave him a verbal warning, which I didn't know and wasn't even sure that he did in deed did not putt out)
            so that was the worse of them all, not even finishing a hole.
            803.13 Holing Out
            A. A player who fails to play any hole or fails to hole out on any hole during the round may be disqualified, at the discretion of the director, using the following guidelines:
            (1) Holes missed due to late arrival may be scored and penalized according to section 804.02.
            (2) Inadvertently failing to hole out (as determined by a majority of the group or an official) shall result in 2 penalty throws being added to the number of throws plus penalty throws already taken on the hole. The hole shall then be considered completed.
            (3) Intentionally failing to hole out (emergency, injury, plane flight, etc.) constitutes withdrawal from competition. The player shall be withdrawn from competition and officially listed as "Did Not Finish" on the scorecard and in the event results.

            Originally posted by snap7times View Post
            2. Not using a marker for almost all of his shots. I had to give him one of my mini's with like 4 holes left when I finally realized he wasn't using a mini at all.
            *I later learned that another guy had given him a mini earlier which the miniless guy lost on the very next hole*
            803.03 Marking the Lie
            G. A player shall receive a warning for the first violation of a marking rule if observed by
            two or more players of the group or an official. One penalty throw shall be assessed for each
            subsequent violation of any marking rule during the round if observed by two or more players of
            the group or an official.
            Originally posted by snap7times View Post
            3. Anything under 20 feet, he just picked up the disc and putt out with nothing marking his lie.
            See above

            Originally posted by snap7times View Post
            4. On the very last hole, the famous hole 10 that tied everything up, the guy was supposed to tee off 3rd, but he just got up there and hurled his tee shot up the hill first. This confused me and before I could confirm that he had tee'd off way out of order
            Ok... this one was an actual courtesy violation. Warning the first time, penalty stroke every time after that.

            801.02 Order of Play

            B. Teeing order on all subsequent tees is determined by the
            scores on the previous hole, with the lowest score throwing first, and
            so on. If the previous hole was a tie, the scores are to be counted
            back until the order is resolved.

            E. Throwing out of turn shall be considered a courtesy violation. See 801.01G.


            If properly handled, your round never would have gone to a playoff. This guy should have been penalized at least two strokes (not holing out) and possibly more if he chose not to heed warnings regarding the marking of his lie (which it sounds like he did not). Sure, it worked out OK for you, but it might not have. Nate and Matt have caused to be a little miffed - this dude ending up beating Nate by one and Matt by two.

            Comment


            • #7
              Nathan:

              Did you split the scrip for first place as listed in the results on the PDGA website?

              If so, we need to rectify the error since (according to the PDGA competition manual):

              1.9 Tiebreakers: C. First place cash/prize must be awarded to the division winner and listed in the event results. Cash or prizes may not be evenly split between any players tied for 1st place.

              This happened to the PGMs too, and that's been untangled, but I didn't notice it in Intermediate (until now).

              Comment


              • #8
                Not holing out.....
                Not marking lie......
                Throwing out of turn......

                If it wasn't called it didn't happen and nobody has a bitch! Period!

                Bob

                Comment


                • #9
                  i agree with bob!!

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by JMan View Post
                    What about a time violation? I heard tell of a guy who walked every shot...waited for his turn to throw, then walked almost to the basket, then back to his disc, then he made his shot...on every shot. Isn't there, by pdga rule, a time frame you must make your shot? Is it long enough for a player to walk every shot before throwing? Now I don't throw tourneys, not many anyway, but that would drive me crazy if it were allowed.
                    Lol... I hope that is me that you are talking about but I only do that when I'm like 50-60 feet or less from the basket... now I don't want any pity, but when you are both Deaf and have some life long depth perception vision issues, sometimes you need to reassure the measurement through walking it, and if I walked all the way to the basket, it was to measure the 10m. But ironically, since I made the least amount of shots, therefore I saved time there heh... But never do I walk on teeshots or over like 100 feet etc. Since you said it was every shot then it was definitely not me heh. But the guys in my group did finally confront me on this after the tournament and I told him since we were not part of any kind of back-up, I didn't feel the need to hurry but if they would have mentioned it, I would have done a few seconds faster heh...

                    As for calling the guy on it, you ever risk being the handicapped guy calling people on every violation? I don't need any more sterotyping on me heh and I had no idea how the other 2 guys felt until afterwards, and I was never going to talk about it but someone asked so I think we can all learn from this situation and be better educated next time it happens. And I agree about the Kabza's being miffed, that why they finally told me all the violations that I didn't see after the round was over so...

                    I have yet to get my script so that is good news, however I am sure the other guy has collected on his extra script heh.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      If everyone wore sidearms, everyone would be more courteous.
                      The Corporate Empire is NOT a Constitutional Republic...
                      ...but it plays one on TV.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Snap, the Kabza's were not miffed at all with your play. You did great and deserved the win. When we all move up we won't be having this conversation See ya next year.

                        The guy you tied with should have had 38 extra strokes added to his score. HAHA!

                        No playoff was needed
                        kabza

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Ol' Bob View Post
                          If everyone wore sidearms, everyone would be more courteous.
                          Or more dead.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I wish we all would call more penalties and stop worrying so much about people thinking we're mean. Why have rules if we aren't going to enforce them?

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              heh, i'll one up you dexterhawk... I wish players would stop trying to circumvent the rules putting other players in the tough position of having to decide if they should call it or not...

                              Comment

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