2009 Oregon Series Points

[Flash]

Here are the updated points before the Calapooia Classic:

2009 Oregon Series Points for Pro (http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=t01K4lo9_XbQT_ghGMMu2SQ&output=html)

2009 Oregon Series Points for Advanced Amateur (http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=t9iWxb3U49ylE5y5deLKEcQ&output=html)

2009 Oregon Series Points for Amateur (http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=tTtR1Wro4yo6XYJSzboboxg&output=html)

If you have any questions or you notice mistakes please let me know. Please reserve the posting in this thread to direct question and answers. If you are wondering how the points are calculated or how the winners are determined feel free to ask.

[Flash]

Rules for points:
1. Points will be awarded based on play within division
2. No points will be awarded for attending
3. No points will be awarded for DNF
4. Points are only awarded for regular play; final 9’s do no count toward your points for the event. Points can only be fairly awarded if everyone in your division plays the round.
5. Champion is crowned based on best 4 Point totals in the division
6. If the result of the 4 best point totals leaves a tie for first place in the division, the tie breakers will happen as follows:
a. Number of First Place finishes
b. Number of wins versus each other in same events played
c. Number of Events played
d. If Number of Events played is the same, total overall points for all events
e. If a tie still exists, a putt off will determine the winner

[LegoRules]

Here are the updated points before the Calapooia Classic:

2009 Oregon Series Points for Pro (http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=t01K4lo9_XbQT_ghGMMu2SQ&output=html)

2009 Oregon Series Points for Advanced Amateur (http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=t9iWxb3U49ylE5y5deLKEcQ&output=html)

2009 Oregon Series Points for Amateur (http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=tTtR1Wro4yo6XYJSzboboxg&output=html)

If you have any questions or you notice mistakes please let me know. Please reserve the posting in this thread to direct question and answers. If you are wondering how the points are calculated or how the winners are determined feel free to ask.


How come FM1 has not been updated? :chinscratch:

Cindy :)

[Flash]

Calculating Points for an Event:


Points are based on a maximum of 100 total points, with points descending from 100 based on play against the winner of the division. The points are not based on whole integer values and can be decimal values. There is no limitation on divisional sizes, like in a top down scoring fashion. Ties are severely reduced by allowing accuracy to 2 decimal places.

[Flash]

Here are the point updates to include the Calapooia Classic this past weekend in Albany:

2009 Pro Oregon Series Points (http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=te4R8jVqYedhnN5Js2z_eZA&output=html)

2009 Adv Oregon Series Points (http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=tGOz8omOHFa4-KgwO1hI1Hw&output=html)

2009 AM Oregon Series Points (http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=tG6OOp5FyuoPYzTuMSdV3mg&output=html)

[james_the_kid]

hey mike for rose city cory coats got 4 and i got 2 just to let you know it could change standings

[RonTheWhip]

i saw that too, but the points do not take into account the FINAL 9. so yes, you beat him, but oddly you get less points (after three rounds he was ahead). That is, assuming I know what I'm talking about.

[Flash]

Final 9's can not be taken into account due to the nature of the final 9. The points are based on the play of the people in your division so therefore it must be a round that everyone plays in.

I am thinking of changing that next year but this year only regular rounds are considered. Much like final 9 rounds are not rated neither are they counted in the overall points. I am not a fan of final 9's purely from the standpoint that they are so different from the regular rounds. Sure they allow a player to make a mad dash for the front but usually only on a modified layout from the layouts used in regular play. Sure you might be able to shred the final 9 layout but since others in your division might have also been able to shred it and gain place but were not included in the format due to space I choose not to include the scores in the points calculation.

James, I think the 2nd place finish is more enjoyable for you from a cashing standpoint though! Also your score should be reflective of the 3 rounds that you played.

This is also covered in the Rules in the second post.

[Sam]

Maybe a point for being in the final 9? 1 for 4th, 2 for 3rd, 3 for 2nd and 4 for 1st?

I don't know... I am just bored.

[Flash]

Maybe a point for being in the final 9? 1 for 4th, 2 for 3rd, 3 for 2nd and 4 for 1st?

I don't know... I am just bored.

Its a good idea and I am accepting all ideas, I also thought to add the worst score in the final 9 to every player not playing in the final 9 to calculate the points out but that just seems unfair. The thing about adding in points to the mix is the winner then would achieve a score higher than 100 points so I am not sure I like that but I bet something could be worked out to make it slick.

I have dropped the 1 point for attending this year to maximize more of the Champion determination on the play not the signing up.

[snap7times]

I just hope this situation does not become a factor in end of series payout.... lets see...

[Flash]

I just hope this situation does not become a factor in end of series payout.... lets see...

What do you mean it was clearly stated before the points were announced so it clearly does not effect the points regardless.

[RonTheWhip]

is there payout this year?

[snap7times]

I just mean if one of them should've, could've, would've related to points based on different place scores from final 9's etc bsbs... and I was assuming there is a series payout no? I guess maybe Flash just doing the points out of his good nature?

[Flash]

is there payout this year?

Payout from What?

Actually I have been in contact with the clubs to see if any of them are interested in supporting end of year awards and such. If you are interested and belong to a club in Oregon let them know how you feel. I don't think I could afford it out of my pocket.

[RonTheWhip]

Payout from What?

Actually I have been in contact with the clubs to see if any of them are interested in supporting end of year awards and such. If you are interested and belong to a club in Oregon let them know how you feel. I don't think I could afford it out of my pocket.

I didn't expect there to be one, just thought I'd ask :]

[purediscgolf]

I didn't expect there to be one, just thought I'd ask :]

I was just thinking that if everyone chipped in a bit maybe we could make an Oregon Series Payout this year. :cheers:

What if we started to gather items from donors at the Eugene Celebration to be raffled off at the Willamette Open. We would have a month to accumulate enough discs and gear to make a pretty nice raffle. I will donate my time to produce a Series Champion Trophy for each major division (Pro, Masters, ADV, INT, Pro Women, AM Women).:yay::chug:

It's just an idea. I know between all the local collectors and discaholics we could get everyone to kick down at least one disc and get a nice raffle together.

Cash raised from the raffle could be used as a Payout for the Pro field and utilized for planning the Oregon Series 2010.:dancing::trophy:

What are your thoughts.....?

[Flash]

I was just thinking that if everyone chipped in a bit maybe we could make an Oregon Series Payout this year. :cheers:

What if we started to gather items from donors at the Eugene Celebration to be raffled off at the Willamette Open. We would have a month to accumulate enough discs and gear to make a pretty nice raffle. I will donate my time to produce a Series Champion Trophy for each major division (Pro, Masters, ADV, INT, Pro Women, AM Women).:yay::chug:

It's just an idea. I know between all the local collectors and discaholics we could get everyone to kick down at least one disc and get a nice raffle together.

Cash raised from the raffle could be used as a Payout for the Pro field and utilized for planning the Oregon Series 2010.:dancing::trophy:

What are your thoughts.....?

Andrew, I am open to any and all ideas, I personally would like to see the series awards continue and the champions be crowned. I have no vested interest in the Oregon Series other than keeping the series points this year. It has been and will continue to be my goal of promoting the series winners and looking to the clubs that run the events in the series to take part ownership of the series going forward.

I am not so sure any money raised from the raffle should be used for payout this year, perhaps we just focus on either trophies or qualifier prizes and really aim for next year to re-institute the idea of a series final payout when the clubs can set appropriate fees to fund the series awards.

[all2common]

Mike, how exactly are you totaling the points? Is it .5 points per stroke or something similar to value in stroke count? Also, do you have time to roll out an update before the Willy O?

[Flash]

Mike, how exactly are you totaling the points? Is it .5 points per stroke or something similar to value in stroke count? Also, do you have time to roll out an update before the Willy O?

The values of the strokes are calculated based on the max score and min score in each division and where your score falls within that range. The points are not the same at each event for each stroke because it varies greatly on the play of the division. However it is normalized such that the winner will always acheive 100 points and each person below them will be less than 100.

So this is the calculation: remember this is per division......[(max score)-(min score)]/your score = score factor
(your score factor)*100/(max Score Factor)= points

Thats why if you look at certain divisions in certain tournaments the scoring is very tight so the overall change between Max and Min score is a small value and therefore everyone has a point total of 90 or better, however other instances show a large range in the Max to Min score and the points total is spread out more down to a value in the seventies. I know it is not very easy to figure out what you need to score or place to finish in to win or get a certain overall placement but it does encourage you to fight for every stroke because it will effect your overall point total.

For instance if in a tournament you are in second place by 3 strokes and have 3 strokes on third place with two holes to go. It would be very easy to assume that you will not catch first place and you could just cruise into second place, but second place does not guarantee 99 points it depends on how well you shoot in comparison to the leader so instead of just playing real conservative the player may try to reel in some throws and it benefits them to do so, in the points assigned by placement there is no incentive to push any harder you can only get 99 points.

I am working on the update this week but work is getting in the way!

[all2common]

The values of the strokes are calculated based on the max score and min score in each division and where your score falls within that range. The points are not the same at each event for each stroke because it varies greatly on the play of the division. However it is normalized such that the winner will always acheive 100 points and each person below them will be less than 100.

I am working on the update this week but work is getting in the way!

Thanks, Mike. Boo work.

[Flash]

Here are the points updates after the 2009 Eugene Celebration:

2009 Oregon Series Pro Divisions (http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=tVzsd4BdaMIScIjNyOmcySQ&output=html)

2009 Oregon Series Adv Divisions (http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=tpYtjIJ6sXeRKHQr-vwf2aA&output=html)

2009 Oregon Series Am Divisions (http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=tCa9iqy62drv9J5P2dNemdw&output=html)

Time to battle for the finish line, who is going to be the new Oregon Series Champions

[dooley]

flash...could you double check your stats on adv. master...I got first in the fling but you gave rick more points...my 4 best are a 1st a 2ndand 2 3rds...:biggrin2:..and thanks for your work on this...ya rock:rockon:

[dooley]

I guess I read that wrong....but I do not understand if Rick and I tied for 2nd at Hoodoo...we both have a first ,Rick the Calapooia and I the BFS,Rick has a5th at Eugene and an 8th at the BFS,I have 3rd at RCO and Calapooia yet he is ahead of me in points????...I am new to most of this but I thought a 1st,2nd and 2 3rds would score better than a 1st, 2nd,5th and 8th:(

[snap7times]

Rick's 5th place at Eugene was worth 3 points more than Dooley's 3rd at RCO, that is the biggest impact on the outcome there..

[citizens arrest]

Rick's 5th place at Eugene was worth 3 points more than Dooley's 3rd at RCO, that is the biggest impact on the outcome there..

Ya but why don't I have enough points to be in first place, I've played the best I could at all times and I think it's a plot against me, now if I took first at will. open could I make 1'st in the series pt's, oh please mr. webmaster could u let me know.:dancing::dancing::dancing:

[Flash]

Come on guys its based on how you play not on how you finish! Go back and look at the scores in those tournaments and you will have your answers. Place means nothing if you are 10 strokes back from the guy in front of you. The points are based more on consistent play within your division and that is why Rick is leading this thing. Look at his scores vs yours and in events where you did not play against each other look at where you finished by number of strokes not the place of finish.

[dooley]

Come on guys its based on how you play not on how you finish! Go back and look at the scores in those tournaments and you will have your answers. Place means nothing if you are 10 strokes back from the guy in front of you. The points are based more on consistent play within your division and that is why Rick is leading this thing. Look at his scores vs yours and in events where you did not play against each other look at where you finished by number of strokes not the place of finish.

if you did not play well....you would not finish well....I am sure this is some of that new math I have run into as of late:slapface:As far as scores vs scores and in events where we did not play against each other and finishing by number of strokes etc.:confused:that totally explains 1ST 2ND 5th and 8TH beating 1ST 2ND 3RD and 3RD...I guess what your saying is the players in the tourneys I finished 3rd in were not as good in general as the players in the tourneys rick finished 5TH and 8TH in.....:headbang:sorry...I will abide by your numbers as you are the one keepin track....but I guess I am to old and stupid to wrap what is left of my brain cells around the fact I can win the BFS (A tier) (rick 8th) tie for 2nd with rick at Hoodoo,take 3rd at RCO..no rick..take 3RD at Calapooia (rick 1ST) take 7TH to ricks 5TH at Eugene and he is ahead of me because margin of victory:confused::confused:

[Flash]

if you did not play well....you would not finish well....I am sure this is some of that new math I have run into as of late:slapface:As far as scores vs scores and in events where we did not play against each other and finishing by number of strokes etc.:confused:that totally explains 1ST 2ND 5th and 8TH beating 1ST 2ND 3RD and 3RD...I guess what your saying is the players in the tourneys I finished 3rd in were not as good in general as the players in the tourneys rick finished 5TH and 8TH in.....:headbang:sorry...I will abide by your numbers as you are the one keepin track....but I guess I am to old and stupid to wrap what is left of my brain cells around the fact I can win the BFS (A tier) (rick 8th) tie for 2nd with rick at Hoodoo,take 3rd at RCO..no rick..take 3RD at Calapooia (rick 1ST) take 7TH to ricks 5TH at Eugene and he is ahead of me because margin of victory:confused::confused:

Tom why are you getting upset about this. Look no one is saying that you did not play good golf this year, heck you won the BSF but you are not listening to what I am trying to explain to you. I am not trying to demonstrate some level of mathematical skills or anything like that. All I am saying is the points are based on how you played against your division. Yes you won the BSF but only by 1 stroke right so second place got 99.48 points behind your 100 points and look at third they finished 3 strokes back and received 98.46 points, so although you won, your competition kept it really close. Now look at the RCO, you finished in 3rd place 9 strokes behind first and that is why you only received 94.79 points but second place finished 2 strokes back and received 98.78 and that is because first and second place played significantly better than the rest of the field. Now at the Calapooia Rick finished in 1st and received 100 points and distanced himself from second place by 11 strokes and so second place only got 95.34 and you finished in third 12 strokes back and therefore only got 94.94 points. At the Eugene Celebration you finished 11 strokes back from the leader and Rick finished 5 strokes back from the leader and the overall finish for the top 5 was pretty tight score wise so therefore Rick's fifth place finish was better than your third place finish at the RCO or Calapooia.

Now do you see how your finish in overall strokes against your division at an event effects your points for that event.

Tom if you want to talk about this sometime I would be happy to go over it with you and listen to why you hate the new points system. But I used the new system to reward consistent play across 4 best events and that is what it is this year. I am open to what people think about the system and if they want to go back to the old system next year!

[RonTheWhip]

Tom if you want to talk about this sometime I would be happy to go over it with you and listen to why you hate the new points system. But I used the new system to reward consistent play across 4 best events and that is what it is this year. I am open to what people think about the system and if they want to go back to the old system next year!

I love it Mike! Can't wait to see how it shakes out after the WO!

Thanks for all you do :)

Dion

[Reichard]

:whistler:

[SMOKIN JOE]

still seems a bit out of whack to me
why not just get points for what your average rating was
seems a lot easier and more understanding to all
even though you don't compete against everybody
every body's round is rated the same way
that's not the case this way
to me 9th place is 9th place regardless of my score
so theoretically you could win 3 events by 1 stoke, then place 2nd by 20 strokes, the other guy places 2nd all four times losing by 1 stroke
so the guy with 4 second place finishes beats out the guy with 3 wins and a 3rd,
doesn't seem right to me
a victory is a victory, you can't control how many people show up or how well they play,
points should be based on you not other people
I personally like nascars point system, 1st is so much and as you go down the line points between positions gets closer
don't matter if you lap the field or win by a nose
and in reviewing the system, Tom got 94.79 for 3rd in the RCO 9 strokes back yet got 95.34 for the same third 12 strokes back, that doesn't make since, got more points for further behind, that's where the rest of the group comes in, must not have done as well
seems a bit messed up,
shouldn't where you place be more important than how you placed
I feel Tom's pain:pullhair:

[all2common]

It makes "since" that you like Nascar's system.

[Scott]

a victory is a victory, you can't control how many people show up or how well they play,
points should be based on you not other people

But you can control how badly you beat them. That's what this system rewards; how badly you dominated your field.

[dooley]

sorry if I seem more upset than I should be...I understand you wanting a system that awards consistent play and while my placings have been by less strokes than ricks ,1st 2nd & 2 3rds sounds more consistent than 1st the same 2nd 5th & 8th....even more so when I add up our total strokes for our 4 finishes and find I am still 4 strokes better...also if our 1sts and 2nds are a wash and his 5th is better than my 3rd by 3 points then that makes his 8th as good as my other 3rd:confused: I know your system comes out that way and would have to say no I do not like it:pullhair:I have cashed in every event in the series and have the 4 highest finishes and while I know its the sum of your best 4...it just seems wrong....I am bummed but it is what it is... you know what this means whistling rick...:evilgrin:that sandybagger man will be trying to take us both down with a well timed 3rd place:explode:...IT IS ON!...see ya this weekend

[SMOKIN JOE]

so winning means nothing, why do we make trophies to third place then'
sounds like Tom should give his third place trophy to Rick for his fine fifth place effort, he got more points than Tom,
and it ain't how you dominate your field,
it's how the field played,
that's why you get more points being 12 strokes back than you did 9 strokes back for the same place
so your points are decided by how the back markers play
are you not already being judged in your own group
if you dominate your field and your not a pro than you probably shouldn't be in the field anyway, move up
so basicly the tougher the course , the better you do, is what is judged
so how is your round rating any different, actually better, it's a better average of the field than the points are now:cool2:

[Flash]

...
and in reviewing the system, Tom got 94.79 for 3rd in the RCO 9 strokes back yet got 95.34 for the same third 12 strokes back, that doesn't make since, got more points for further behind, that's where the rest of the group comes in, must not have done as well
seems a bit messed up,
shouldn't where you place be more important than how you placed
I feel Tom's pain:pullhair:

Terry what are you trying to say? Have you ever heard of complete sentences? You have more run on thoughts then people want to weed through. Please focus your thoughts better when you type and slow down it seems like you have some good things to add to the discussion but I am having trouble picking them out. Sam help me out here!

The 95.34 was awarded to Jeff Elliot at the Calapooia and yes he finished in second place and he was 11 strokes back from first. The value of one stroke will depend on the courses obviously due to the players just like with the round ratings of players. On certain courses 1 stroke might be worth 10 ratings points but another course 1 stroke may be 7 rating points. The current point system does reward closer to ratings without having to award points across the whole event. It only looks at your play(sort of round ratings if you want to look at it that way) against your division and awards points based on the winner achieving 100 points.

The problem I have with a top down awarding of points is based on field size. If at one event you are in a division of three people you will always get 98 points even if you finish 100 strokes back. Then in another week at a larger event a player shoots 2 strokes back from first place and also gets 98 points but who played a better tournament in their field.

To me people should not be rewarded based on theyfinish but on how they play in the event against the field at the event. Since there is no awards this year for the Oregon Series it does not matter other than bragging rights. Perhaps I can start a poll and see what method should prevail for next year.

[Flash]

so winning means nothing, why do we make trophies to third place then'
sounds like Tom should give his third place trophy to Rick for his fine fifth place effort, he got more points than Tom,
and it ain't how you dominate your field,
it's how the field played

Trophies for Place in the event have nothing to do with trophies in the series. I hope you can see that the events are a single entity that is finalized at the event awards ceremony, while the series is a culmination of the entire series of events. Trophies in events are awarded based on place as well as play(how many strokes you throw) because it does not matter how you finished in third place the guy behind you still did not shoot better then you did. Is this making sense to anyone else on this forum?

[Matt B.]

Trophies for Place in the event have nothing to do with trophies in the series. I hope you can see that the events are a single entity that is finalized at the event awards ceremony, while the series is a culmination of the entire series of events. Trophies in events are awarded based on place as well as play(how many strokes you throw) because it does not matter how you finished in third place the guy behind you still did not shoot better then you did. Is this making sense to anyone else on this forum?

It makes sense to me, thanks for VOLUNTARILY stepping up to OFFER SOMETHING TO THE COMMUNITY with no reward, Mike! It's pretty funny that panties are this bunched over your efforts as THERE ARE NO TROPHIES OR PAYOUT.

Perhaps the people with the problem should just calculate the series points in the method they prefer and show us their results. Then we can complain about the way that they did it. Since there IS NO SERIES this year, no trophies, and nothing to win, what does it matter how Flash decided to compile these standings? You don't like it? Do your own.

[snap7times]

heh... yeah! What he said...

[dooley]

Trophies for Place in the event have nothing to do with trophies in the series. I hope you can see that the events are a single entity that is finalized at the event awards ceremony, while the series is a culmination of the entire series of events. Trophies in events are awarded based on place as well as play(how many strokes you throw) because it does not matter how you finished in third place the guy behind you still did not shoot better then you did. Is this making sense to anyone else on this forum?

yes....but in a series formula as yours[it is not how you finish,but how you play] maybe [how many strokes you throw] total should be a factor somehow...:chinscratch:but I do agree that....[it does not matter HOW you finished in third place the guy behind you still did not shoot better than you did.]....I just wish that had a numerical value in your formula as well :D

[SMOKIN JOE]

go nascar
a 1,2,5,8 beats a 1,2,3,3
not in nascar:bowing:

["Over the Hill" Bob]

I THINK I see Mikes thought process here, let me see if I'm right.

My basketball team has five players and play another team with five players. We get X number of points.

My team plays a team with only 3 players and we whup the heck out of them. Worth less points.

My team plays a team with only 2 players and we REALLY whup um. Worth even less points.

My team plays a team with 8 players and we beat them but barely. Worth more points than a win playing a team with 5 players but it was much more difficult.

Am I on the right track here?

Bob:biggrin2:

["Over the Hill" Bob]

Oh yeah..............thanks Mike for your work here.:trophy:

Bob

[dooley]

I know there are NO SERIES AWARDS...and I thanked mike for all this work when I first saw it on here...I also explained while I was bummed at no series I was playin them all anyway....I do not wear panties nor are my underwear in a bunch....but when you say WHO WILL BE THE NEXT SERIES CHAMPIONS...I guess it gets me going......I have been playing 3 years so pardon me for gettin a little fired up at the chance of takin down the big dogs in any tourney or series...they made taking an ass whipping as fun as could be....I never intended for this to be more than it is.....Flash thanks again and I do have an idea....1 point per player in your divison available per tourney....20 players...19 points (you do not count yourself)...4 players 3 points etc. awarded in order......no problem with size of field issues....ties could be decided by total strokes....just a thought for next year....

[SMOKIN JOE]

no don't get that one
the teams should be even to start with
when did third place stop counting for something
damn near every sport has a 1,2,3
they usually stop awarding and counting after that
did you all watch the fed ex cup,
point system simular to nascar
the higher you finish the more points you recieve
as you go down the list the points become less between finishes
for example
1=500
2=450
3=405
4=365
gradually stairstepping down to
50=1
if you are out side the top 50 then you get no points
gold , silver , bronze ,
win , place , show ,
the podeum in all auto sports, 1,2,3
can't see how an 8th could be worth a 3rd in any occasion
the major 4 mojor sports only care about number 1, a victory
don't matter how you get it thier all the same
don't matter if it's 69-0 or 10-3
don't matter if you play the lions or the giants
by the way Hockey not bieng on of them, soccer
when did how bad you beat someone become important
shouldn't placing ahead of them be enough:cheers:

[RonTheWhip]

no don't get that one
the teams should be even to start with
when did third place stop counting for something
damn near every sport has a 1,2,3
they usually stop awarding and counting after that
did you all watch the fed ex cup,
point system simular to nascar
the higher you finish the more points you recieve
as you go down the list the points become less between finishes
for example
1=500
2=450
3=405
4=365
gradually stairstepping down to
50=1
if you are out side the top 50 then you get no points
gold , silver , bronze ,
win , place , show ,
the podeum in all auto sports, 1,2,3
can't see how an 8th could be worth a 3rd in any occasion
the major 4 mojor sports only care about number 1, a victory
don't matter how you get it thier all the same
don't matter if it's 69-0 or 10-3
don't matter if you play the lions or the giants
by the way Hockey not bieng on of them, soccer
when did how bad you beat someone become important
shouldn't placing ahead of them be enough:cheers:

I started reading this last post as an abstract poem and it actually sounds quite beautiful.

Seriously, there are so many different ways to calculate series winners its not even funny. Personally I like the way Mike does things and if this were to be the official method for next year I'd be down. Mike is the only person keeping track of things for our enjoyment, so the fact that any player in any division is having issues is ridiculous. Here are a few criteria that I think are important when deciding a series winner:

1. rewarding consistent play
2. rewarding high participation and attendence (bonus for attending more events)
3. stroke differentials (easy to do on a one event scale, impossible to do on an a seven event scale, since not every player will attend every event)
4. reward the 1st place finish, it is tough to win (especially in large fields), I would like to see a small bonus attached to the "W".
5. the more players you beat, the more points you should earn.

I'll be thinking more about this topic and try to develop my own method :)

[Bullseye]

I started reading this last post as an abstract poem and it actually sounds quite beautiful.

Seriously, there are so many different ways to calculate series winners its not even funny. Personally I like the way Mike does things and if this were to be the official method for next year I'd be down. Mike is the only person keeping track of things for our enjoyment, so the fact that any player in any division is having issues is ridiculous. Here are a few criteria that I think are important when deciding a series winner:

1. rewarding consistent play
2. rewarding high participation and attendence (bonus for attending more events)
3. stroke differentials (easy to do on a one event scale, impossible to do on an a seven event scale, since not every player will attend every event)
4. reward the 1st place finish, it is tough to win (especially in large fields), I would like to see a small bonus attached to the "W".
5. the more players you beat, the more points you should earn.

I'll be thinking more about this topic and try to develop my own method :)

Flash's method of calculating points is one of the best I have seen. I love the fact that you get points based on how you play in relation to the field. I also love the fact that if you only beat your opponents by a stroke you don't get as many points as you would have had you totally crushed them.

[all2common]

I started reading this last post as an abstract poem and it actually sounds quite beautiful.


That's rich. Thanks Dion for making my morning.

[Matt B.]

I know there are NO SERIES AWARDS...and I thanked mike for all this work when I first saw it on here...I also explained while I was bummed at no series I was playin them all anyway....I do not wear panties nor are my underwear in a bunch....but when you say WHO WILL BE THE NEXT SERIES CHAMPIONS...I guess it gets me going......I have been playing 3 years so pardon me for gettin a little fired up at the chance of takin down the big dogs in any tourney or series...they made taking an ass whipping as fun as could be....I never intended for this to be more than it is.....Flash thanks again and I do have an idea....1 point per player in your divison available per tourney....20 players...19 points (you do not count yourself)...4 players 3 points etc. awarded in order......no problem with size of field issues....ties could be decided by total strokes....just a thought for next year....

Simple then. Put together the spreadsheet, show it to everyone, and declare yourself (or whoever) the champion of this way of calculating the ratings.

[DexterHawk]

Besides the champion of the Oregon Series is the winner in Open... the champion in Advanced is the winner of the guy who should have moved up a year ago award!

[SMOKIN JOE]

is golf not an individual sport
then why would the scores of other people effect your outcome
as for how bad you beat someone
take basketball for example
if your up 30 in the fourth quarter and still have your starters in
guaranteed one of them is going to get a hard foul
football, someone is going to get hurt
running up the score is not very sportsman like
being judged by how bad you beat someone is the same thing, unsportsmanlike
you should be happy to just beat someone, finish ahead of them, not how badly did i beat them, sounds to macho for me,
I'll stick to old school, sportsmanship
so when you're playing your not worried about just winning then
your worried about how bad you beat the next guy and how the rest of the field played that day, because that's how you become a series champion
finishing 1,2,3,3 and having less total strokes does not beat 1,2,5,8,
four trophies doesn't = 2 trophies
so where is this consistency your talking about
what it boils down to is how bad you beat the next guy and how the rest of the field plays :cool2:

[DexterHawk]

Yes, but joe what if you want to compare the value of one win to another win... By examining how the rest of the field did by comparison you can compare victories.

It sounds like you are playing some great golf this summer... I'm sure people have noticed... Don't let the math get you down.

[snap7times]

Besides the champion of the Oregon Series is the winner in Open... the champion in Advanced is the winner of the guy who should have moved up a year ago award!

That's a great way to ruin the am division, accusing every possible winner of sandbagging? Someone has to win, can't blame the winner for staying in ADV and not crumbling to peer pressure to move up. If you look closely, there are way too many players playing up instead of their appropriate division or just one division up instead of two or three divisions up. We will always have "sandbaggers" and "eager bunnies who donate money to the division winners". Only way to get middle ground is to encourage peoeple to play their appropriate division or one division up and they make their own decision. Example, I'm 911 rated, I won the Intermediate division at Eugene with a 936 average. Should I move up? Had I played ADV, I would have been in like 18th place or something. Bah Hum Bug...

[Matt B.]

That's a great way to ruin the am division, accusing every possible winner of sandbagging? Someone has to win, can't blame the winner for staying in ADV and not crumbling to peer pressure to move up. If you look closely, there are way too many players playing up instead of their appropriate division or just one division up instead of two or three divisions up. We will always have "sandbaggers" and "eager bunnies who donate money to the division winners". Only way to get middle ground is to encourage peoeple to play their appropriate division or one division up and they make their own decision. Example, I'm 911 rated, I won the Intermediate division at Eugene with a 936 average. Should I move up? Had I played ADV, I would have been in like 18th place or something. Bah Hum Bug...

So now that you have a 1st place in MA2, will you move up to MA1?

You should. :)

[RonTheWhip]

That's a great way to ruin the am division, accusing every possible winner of sandbagging? Someone has to win, can't blame the winner for staying in ADV and not crumbling to peer pressure to move up. If you look closely, there are way too many players playing up instead of their appropriate division or just one division up instead of two or three divisions up. We will always have "sandbaggers" and "eager bunnies who donate money to the division winners". Only way to get middle ground is to encourage peoeple to play their appropriate division or one division up and they make their own decision. Example, I'm 911 rated, I won the Intermediate division at Eugene with a 936 average. Should I move up? Had I played ADV, I would have been in like 18th place or something. Bah Hum Bug...

Haha, Nate...Andy is just kidding. I feel because of the ORS, players are more reluctant to move up in order to place well in their division. Either way, its a good thing that more people play up than down, but it would be nice if more people played where they need to.

[snap7times]

We will see what my new rating is in 3 weeks... Probably around 920-925... Technically I don't have to move up until I reach 935... But it all depends on the tournament. In Oregon, especially, adv is rough, but fun, so it's a possibility... hehe... Damned if I stay, damned if I move up? I've already played several tournaments in MA1 so I do know what I am missing out on...

For fun, I looked up Eugene to see some stats based on Rating...
In the Open Division, I think anyone rated under 950 should play ADV. The highest finish by a under 950 rated player was 15th place. 8 more under 950 filled up the bottom half of the open division.
In the Adv Divison, I think anyone rated under 920 should play Int. The highest finish by a under 920 rated player was 7th, with the next 920 under rated player placing 28th with 7 of the last 10 spots in ADV with players rated 920 or less, 3 being less than 900, meaning they jumped up 2 divisions.
So lets say 6 of those 9 in ADV move down to INT and 3 went to Rec, the bottom 4-6 from INT played Rec, wow we would have like 7-9 in REC, and each feild would be much more competitive from ADV-REC... Just saying... *just giving everyone more reasons to never leave this website*

[DexterHawk]

When to move up and when you are sandbagging are both great questions... but when I was in the Am ranks it was quite clear that the winner ORS Advanced player of the year award could clearly have competed in PRO (Chandler would have won one of the tournaments).

Playing for the glory of winning Am was never that big of a goal of mine... anytime I began to feel like I should be winning my division I moved up. I had one win in Advanced and one in Intermediate, niether of them in the Oregon Series. My first trophy at an Oregon series event was a third place I got in Pro last year.

I could have stayed in Advanced for an extra year and I might have won two or three events, maybe... but I know that I would not be as good as I am now. There is nothing like actually failing (ie not making any cash) to motivate me to work on my game. And the counter part to your someone has to win argument is that someone has to lose.

I would rather lose with honor than to have to wonder if I was being a jerk. Basically what I tell guys is that you will know when it's the right time to move. It's different for everyone. But I do firmly believe that the only champion of any tournament is the winner in the Open division in Men and the Open division in Women. Some other folks won there division, those people won the tournament.

[Bullseye]

We will see what my new rating is in 3 weeks... Probably around 920-925... Technically I don't have to move up until I reach 935... But it all depends on the tournament. In Oregon, especially, adv is rough, but fun, so it's a possibility... hehe... Damned if I stay, damned if I move up? I've already played several tournaments in MA1 so I do know what I am missing out on...

For fun, I looked up Eugene to see some stats based on Rating...
In the Open Division, I think anyone rated under 950 should play ADV. The highest finish by a under 950 rated player was 15th place. 8 more under 950 filled up the bottom half of the open division.
In the Adv Divison, I think anyone rated under 920 should play Int. The highest finish by a under 920 rated player was 7th, with the next 920 under rated player placing 28th with 7 of the last 10 spots in ADV with players rated 920 or less, 3 being less than 900, meaning they jumped up 2 divisions.
So lets say 6 of those 9 in ADV move down to INT and 3 went to Rec, the bottom 4-6 from INT played Rec, wow we would have like 7-9 in REC, and each feild would be much more competitive from ADV-REC... Just saying... *just giving everyone more reasons to never leave this website*

Stay in Intermediate until the PDGA boots you up to Advanced. Thats how the system is supposed to work, and if everyone did it like that it would be working fine. Alas, the jump from Advanced to Open is not quite so clear cut.

[Scott]

Stay in Intermediate until the PDGA boots you up to Advanced. Thats how the system is supposed to work, and if everyone did it like that it would be working fine. Alas, the jump from Advanced to Open is not quite so clear cut.

Words of wisdom, once again. :cheers:

[dooley]

Flash....I just want to apologize if it seemed I was attacking you or your work...that was not my intention...I see how your system rates his 5th higher than either of my 3rds but not both...which means his 8th was as good as the other 3rd..sorry ...I digress...just know I am not upset and would love to buy ya a :chug:....just for stirring this up!...or perhaps some of my wonderful elixir(citron & grape juice)..is in order...your choice...I will be there ready to have another awesome golf weekend...thanks again

[snap7times]

The recent win in MA2 was my first win and trophy for 1st... and I'll be MA1 in 2010 regardless... Funny stuff..

[dooley]

When to move up and when you are sandbagging are both great questions... but when I was in the Am ranks it was quite clear that the winner ORS Advanced player of the year award could clearly have competed in PRO (Chandler would have won one of the tournaments).

Playing for the glory of winning Am was never that big of a goal of mine... anytime I began to feel like I should be winning my division I moved up. I had one win in Advanced and one in Intermediate, niether of them in the Oregon Series. My first trophy at an Oregon series event was a third place I got in Pro last year.

I could have stayed in Advanced for an extra year and I might have won two or three events, maybe... but I know that I would not be as good as I am now. There is nothing like actually failing (ie not making any cash) to motivate me to work on my game. And the counter part to your someone has to win argument is that someone has to lose.

I would rather lose with honor than to have to wonder if I was being a jerk. Basically what I tell guys is that you will know when it's the right time to move. It's different for everyone. But I do firmly believe that the only champion of any tournament is the winner in the Open division in Men and the Open division in Women. Some other folks won there division, those people won the tournament.
this is the 1st year I have had any success...I started in mm1 because I am old and had not played very long( 2 years)...i sure did not belong in open..so playing well enough this year to go from sub 900 to a 930+ rating is cool...but should I have to move up to pro master mid year? I could play open...but would that not take a spot from you young guns...and be playin up to far?...I feel the Am divs. are there for the rest of us to have fun until we get good enough to play pro...if we do....but I agree if you are DOMINATING your div. you should move up....

[DexterHawk]

I will admit that smaller divisions are trickier... But in AM and ADV I think a win is a pretty convincing invitation to try the waters in the next division.

[Flash]

Flash....I just want to apologize if it seemed I was attacking you or your work...that was not my intention...I see how your system rates his 5th higher than either of my 3rds but not both...which means his 8th was as good as the other 3rd..sorry ...I digress...just know I am not upset and would love to buy ya a :chug:....just for stirring this up!...or perhaps some of my wonderful elixir(citron & grape juice)..is in order...your choice...I will be there ready to have another awesome golf weekend...thanks again


Tom no worries it just felt like I was banging my head against the wall explaining how the points were calculated. I realize it is not like last year or the year before but its OK to try something new. This method has been used before and I am excited to have some input to as to how we can tweak it to make it even better. It sounds like Dion has some cool ideas so we will have to talk sometime.

As for golf, it will not be for me the rest of this year and most of next year. I got my MRI results back and I have some scar tissue in the right shoulder rotary cuff and a tear in the right arm Coracobrachialis. The result of which is I have plenty of strength in the Right Arm and Shoulder but the whipping action of throwing a disc is beyond painful at this point due to the tear. I have plenty of other things to keep me busy though....

[snap7times]

when is the surgery? and please recover fast dude

[dooley]

Tom no worries it just felt like I was banging my head against the wall explaining how the points were calculated. I realize it is not like last year or the year before but its OK to try something new. This method has been used before and I am excited to have some input to as to how we can tweak it to make it even better. It sounds like Dion has some cool ideas so we will have to talk sometime.

As for golf, it will not be for me the rest of this year and most of next year. I got my MRI results back and I have some scar tissue in the right shoulder rotary cuff and a tear in the right arm Coracobrachialis. The result of which is I have plenty of strength in the Right Arm and Shoulder but the whipping action of throwing a disc is beyond painful at this point due to the tear. I have plenty of other things to keep me busy though....

:shocked: bummmmmmmmer....I am truly sorry about your injury and would also like to wish you a speedy and full recovery....as far as the point system...it is all good...I have to admit I probably needed this to get me fired up about my game...I have been slack....it really showed up in Eugene..missed putts from 8 to 10 feet....multiple times:slapface:

[Scott]

As for golf, it will not be for me the rest of this year and most of next year. I got my MRI results back and I have some scar tissue in the right shoulder rotary cuff and a tear in the right arm Coracobrachialis. The result of which is I have plenty of strength in the Right Arm and Shoulder but the whipping action of throwing a disc is beyond painful at this point due to the tear.
I am very sorry to hear that, dude. :(

[dooley]

It makes sense to me, thanks for VOLUNTARILY stepping up to OFFER SOMETHING TO THE COMMUNITY with no reward, Mike! It's pretty funny that panties are this bunched over your efforts as THERE ARE NO TROPHIES OR PAYOUT.

Perhaps the people with the problem should just calculate the series points in the method they prefer and show us their results. Then we can complain about the way that they did it. Since there IS NO SERIES this year, no trophies, and nothing to win, what does it matter how Flash decided to compile these standings? You don't like it? Do your own.

I do not think I know you...but since you jumped in ...my calculation my 4 placings I beat 52 other scores ricks 4 placings he beat 38 scores....complain away....none of this is relevant as THERE ARE NO TROPHIES OR PAYOUT.flash & I are cool...but thanks for your input

[smobro]

The recent win in MA2 was my first win and trophy for 1st... and I'll be MA1 in 2010 regardless... Funny stuff..

Cool did you say you won in Eugene? Awesome.

[smobro]

did these calculations take into consideration the angle of the rotational axis of the earth in comparison to venus when each player putted on each hole? We know the polarity has a HUGE effect on putting.

What about the Beyonce' Effect? That is the effect that listening to a song by Beyonce' in close proximity to your tee time can greatly modify your overall scoring per round.

What about the Absurd Factor? that is the amount life I expended to read through this thread. I feel like I should be awarded 2 Oregon Series Points just for wading through this silliness.

But in truth, Mike is a rock star and I appreciate his crunching of the proverbial numbers. I am sorry you wont be in the fight out there. You were definitely turning the corner toward going Pro


GO CRUSTIES!!!

[Matt B.]

I do not think I know you...but since you jumped in ...my calculation my 4 placings I beat 52 other scores ricks 4 placings he beat 38 scores....complain away....none of this is relevant as THERE ARE NO TROPHIES OR PAYOUT.flash & I are cool...but thanks for your input

Who's complaining? But, we'll need to see the whole spreadsheet. :) And you're welcome.

[snap7times]

Cool did you say you won in Eugene? Awesome.

yeah... sudden death playoff for first... regulation play came down to a sickkk putt for birdie on the final hole 10 for the other guy who had tons of courtesy violation issues which we were nice enough not to stroke him at all *kabza was more bothered by this since he saw the worse violation of them all*... and my tee shot hit one of the trees past where it becomes flatter and should have just dropeed but it took a funny bounce backwards and rolled all the way to the left side and then back to the middle about 50 feet in front of the tee, I had to par to win if everyone else par'ed or worse. Thumb'd a teerex straight through the gap to park it for the win, but the other guy made a 40 foot around the trees on the left to bird to tie.

Sudden death hole was the pathway near picnic tables near the lake shooting up to the practice basket about 350-375'. Flipped for it, guy won, told me to go first, with the pros watching from tee 1 and Rebecca standing right there, i just thought to myself to rip it hard and pray i park it. Ripped it, flew perfect all the way and landed 10-15 feet away. The other guy just threw a crappy shot about 250' and gave up, i urged him to finish out, he had a bad attitude and just over threw the upshot about 40 feet to the left. I made the birdie for the win. Ironically the teeshot was my best of the tournament, i guess when sexton gives you a lesson, you want to show you learned at least one thing... Fun stuff I tell ya...

[DexterHawk]

The powers of good win out over the powers of grumpy!!!

I hope everyone is reading this!

[SMOKIN JOE]

totally agree
it sucks that my rating is 915
well I guess it was worse
so 915 is better
that's why I'm in intermediate
shouldn't play against 940+ rankings
now my home course where I do well
or Timber were I always do well, then maybe move up
to move up just to move up puts players in that division against not as good of players
when I play around with my son and other local kids or a group of rec golfers
my score is usually not as good as if I were playing people with more skills
that's why people move up
get your lessons outside the tournaments
but as long as pdga rules allow this . then we will talk about it
can't blame anyone from wanting to move up
one way to make it more even would be to set the cards by ratings
I know if I were a top pro I would not want my first card to have 3 people with sub 900 ratings, seen some low rankings in the open fields
just a thought
make them work up to a higher rated player:cheers:

[Scott]

...the other guy who had tons of courtesy violation issues which we were nice enough not to stroke him at all *kabza was more bothered by this since he saw the worse violation of them all*...

I'm curious about what the courtesy violations were and why you decided not to call them. For another thread, perhaps....

[dooley]

Who's complaining? But, we'll need to see the whole spreadsheet. :) And you're welcome.

who is we ? I just used the ones on pdga...I already apologized to flash..posting one on here WOULD be an insult to his work...also irrelevant and redundant...if YOU want to see one or talk about our ideas on formulas I will be at the WOX...look me up...I will buy the first:chug:

[Matt B.]

who is we ? I just used the ones on pdga...I already apologized to flash..posting one on here WOULD be an insult to his work...also irrelevant and redundant...if YOU want to see one or talk about our ideas on formulas I will be at the WOX...look me up...I will buy the first:chug:

That's the royal WE. And I was pushing your buttons for funny. :biggrin2: Good luck this weekend winning in all calculations. :kissflowers:

[dooley]

That's the royal WE. And I was pushing your buttons for funny. :biggrin2: Good luck this weekend winning in all calculations. :kissflowers:

I thought it was WOXI....and I know you were....I was trying to put out some of the fire on the way down:explode:....and its not the calculations that worries me...its being able to drive or putt with my foot in my mouth...that and some of the guys I play against....some real shady characters:shocked:....I will need more than luck against them...my:angel: got hit with a forehand at Incdredibowl spotting for me on 9 on the first day in the fog...have not seen it since....thanks though:seeya:

[Flash]

Final Oregon Series Points have been calculated and posted!

2009 Pro Oregon Series Points (http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=ter5uq75SSaVbrX4Acvrnqw&output=html)

2009 Adv Oregon Series Points (http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=t3McoWysOra6DAzjTM5XxdQ&output=html)

2009 Am Oregon Series Points (http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=tcCU7fZdTCpvOJbhDHESqxQ&output=html)

[smobro]

Way to go Crusty Crushers Reichard, Elliott and Dooley. Recharge those AARP cards and pull up your support hose, cuz we are coming to take you to the old folks home next year.:chug: Great playing with you guys this year. Thanks for the lessons. We will have some young upstarts in MM1 next year. Gibson, play to the shade and bring the Icy Hot.

[Amber]

Final Oregon Series Points have been calculated and posted!

2009 Pro Oregon Series Points (http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=ter5uq75SSaVbrX4Acvrnqw&output=html)

2009 Adv Oregon Series Points (http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=t3McoWysOra6DAzjTM5XxdQ&output=html)

2009 Am Oregon Series Points (http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=tcCU7fZdTCpvOJbhDHESqxQ&output=html)

According to this I won. Do I get anything for it? Does it mean anything? After quick review I think it says that it doesn't really mean anything. But still COOL!!! I won something I wasn't even aware I was in the running for. YEA, YEA!!!!:nahnah:

[all2common]

Good job Lund. Time to move up.

[Lund]

Good job Lund. Time to move up.

Morning, Justiin

[Matt B.]

Morning, Justiin

Sounds like a good topic for a new thread. Who's moving up?

[Scott]

Sounds like a good topic for a new thread. Who's moving up?There should be no debate. Heck, Mike already provided a list (just look for the top couple of names in every division). :biggrin2:

[Magilla]

There should be no debate. Heck, Mike already provided a list (just look for the top couple of names in every division). :biggrin2:

Unless the players rating mandates it, there is NOTHING we can do.. :slapface:

Peer pressure is the next best thing...:whistler:

:seeya:

[Scott]

Unless the players rating mandates it, there is NOTHING we can do.. :slapface:

Peer pressure is the next best thing...:whistler:

:seeya:


I'm not saying anyone should be forced to move up - I would be the last one to say that! I'm the one that strongly advocates playing in the division appropriate for your rating. However, coming out on top of your division in the Oregon Series makes a pretty good case for moving up. I'm not sure what else could be proved by staying put.

[snap7times]

I should open a peer mediation business that specializes in peer pressure issues related to sandbagging and which division peers think their peers should play.... I'd be rich... And yes i'm moving to ADV in 2010 to avoid the massive peer pressure that could crumple me like a brick on an egg...

[Sam]

I am moving up. Well... over.

Advanced Masters is going to be one hell of a fun division next year. Well... the first few months, anyway. Then I get to play with Magilla and Hagerty. I'll have my Dodgers' hat to annoy Magilla and will have bring along a Blackberry to post things on the internet to get to Hagerty.

Looking forward to 2010. Great year 2009. :cheers:

[Magilla]

I'll have my Dodgers' hat to annoy Magilla :cheers:

:laughing: I have one of those......:o
Except mine is signed by Kurt "Gimp"son..........:D

:cheers:

[smobro]

I am moving up. Well... over.

Advanced Masters is going to be one hell of a fun division next year. Well... the first few months, anyway. Then I get to play with Magilla and Hagerty. I'll have my Dodgers' hat to annoy Magilla and will have bring along a Blackberry to post things on the internet to get to Hagerty.

Looking forward to 2010. Great year 2009. :cheers:

Let me interperate this for everyone.

Sam said..... "I will probably poach a couple of top 5 finishes in the adv masters division and if I win 1 then I will move up to Masters and be the creamy center in a Haggerty/Harbour matchup."

At least that is what I heard. Good luck in Adv Masters brother, we kick, bite, and scratch. It's all we have left. Can't wait to play with ya.

:rockon:

[Sam]

Totally looking forward to it.

And I never aim for just top 5. Fortunately for you guys, my aim sucks. :laughing:

["Over the Hill" Bob]

Totally looking forward to it.

And I never aim for just top 5. Fortunately for you guys, my aim sucks. :laughing:

Do NOT except the lollipop! (ask Jordan) :wink2:

Bob

[Minordiety]

Do NOT except the lollipop! (ask Jordan) :wink2:

Bob


AHEM Cabal.:nono:

Do not tell Sam. He will have to learn on his own.

Yea, Sam is moving up to Masters. The crowd goes wild.:headbang:

Now I'm going to have to beat you and Elliott?
:slapface:

Is there a spot open in Grandmasters?

[Sam]

:laughing:

Not for you, young'en. Not yet, anyway.

[Matt B.]

I am moving up. Well... over.

Advanced Masters is going to be one hell of a fun division next year. Well... the first few months, anyway. Then I get to play with Magilla and Hagerty. I'll have my Dodgers' hat to annoy Magilla and will have bring along a Blackberry to post things on the internet to get to Hagerty.

Looking forward to 2010. Great year 2009. :cheers:

Why would you bother with Adv. Masters? That's not moving over from a 2nd place finish in Adv for the ORS, that's moving down. Sorry crusties, but it's true. C'mon Sam, at least go straight to Open Masters. You might even see me there for an event or two next year. :shooting::shooting:

[Flash]

So there was a mistake in the Adv men points, actually some of the Willamette points were not adding up for certain people so here is the newest links with updates. Please let me know if you see any errors.

2009 ADV Oregon Series Points (http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=t3McoWysOra6DAzjTM5XxdQ&output=html)

2009 Pro Oregon Series Points (http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=ter5uq75SSaVbrX4Acvrnqw&output=html)

2009 Am Oregon Series Points (http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=tcCU7fZdTCpvOJbhDHESqxQ&output=html)

[smobro]

Why would you bother with Adv. Masters? That's not moving over from a 2nd place finish in Adv for the ORS, that's moving down. Sorry crusties, but it's true. C'mon Sam, at least go straight to Open Masters. You might even see me there for an event or two next year. :shooting::shooting:


After the bleeding stops and my ego heals, I would have to totally agree were it not for the fact that we may be old, but we're slow and don't care. I have to say, it is raising the bar for us to have Sam join the Crusties. I, for one, am looking forward to the challenge. Don't be surprised if the whole division gets better with age. Matt, you are certainly welcome to join the fraternity of the elderly, but just know we have a code of conduct which includes the youngest members buying drinks at all events until they win one. It might be more difficult than you think with the knee brace, back brace, 5 advils, bad feet and crotchety demeanor that you must have to play in the crusties division.:chug:

[Matt B.]

After the bleeding stops and my ego heals, I would have to totally agree were it not for the fact that we may be old, but we're slow and don't care. I have to say, it is raising the bar for us to have Sam join the Crusties. I, for one, am looking forward to the challenge. Don't be surprised if the whole division gets better with age. Matt, you are certainly welcome to join the fraternity of the elderly, but just know we have a code of conduct which includes the youngest members buying drinks at all events until they win one. It might be more difficult than you think with the knee brace, back brace, 5 advils, bad feet and crotchety demeanor that you must have to play in the crusties division.:chug:

No Smo, yo I went pro, bro.

["Over the Hill" Bob]

No Smo, yo I went pro, bro.

So? :rockon:

Bob

[dooley]

After the bleeding stops and my ego heals, I would have to totally agree were it not for the fact that we may be old, but we're slow and don't care. I have to say, it is raising the bar for us to have Sam join the Crusties. I, for one, am looking forward to the challenge. Don't be surprised if the whole division gets better with age. Matt, you are certainly welcome to join the fraternity of the elderly, but just know we have a code of conduct which includes the youngest members buying drinks at all events until they win one. It might be more difficult than you think with the knee brace, back brace, 5 advils, bad feet and crotchety demeanor that you must have to play in the crusties division.:chug:

I do not have a back brace....yet:yay:

[thadeouspage]

Advanced Masters is going to be one hell of a fun division next year. Well... the first few months, anyway. Then I get to play with Magilla and Hagerty.

Isn't it standard practice that a player can play masters beginning Jan. 1st of the year in which they turn 40? I have in interest in this because I will be 40 next November and was looking forward to moving over next summer as well.

[Matt B.]

Isn't it standard practice that a player can play masters beginning Jan. 1st of the year in which they turn 40? I have in interest in this because I will be 40 next November and was looking forward to moving over next summer as well.

Yes, that is correct, you can play Masters when you are 39 in the calendar year you turn 40.

[Magilla]

Why would you bother with Adv. Masters? That's not moving over from a 2nd place finish in Adv for the ORS, that's moving down. Sorry crusties, but it's true. C'mon Sam, at least go straight to Open Masters. You might even see me there for an event or two next year. :shooting::shooting:

Id have to agree with this one.....:slapface:

When playing at the TOP of the adv. field and then moving to Adv Masters is more like moving DOWN..not even "sideways".
Sandbagger move if you ask me.....:nono:

Come on up to the REAL Masters divison Sammy boy...unless of course you are scared.
:laughing::laughing:

:nahnah:

[Flash]

I am moving up. Well... over.

Advanced Masters is going to be one hell of a fun division next year. Well... the first few months, anyway. Then I get to play with Magilla and Hagerty. I'll have my Dodgers' hat to annoy Magilla and will have bring along a Blackberry to post things on the internet to get to Hagerty.

Looking forward to 2010. Great year 2009. :cheers:

Looks like said he would be playing Pro Master's later in the year but just needs to hone his skills in Adv Masters first. There are a lot of differences he needs to learn about before making the jump into Pro Master's.

[Scott]

Looks like said he would be playing Pro Master's later in the year but just needs to hone his skills in Adv Masters first. There are a lot of differences he needs to learn about before making the jump into Pro Master's.

What's to hone? His rating just jumped to 956, which makes him the 6th highest rated AM in the state (thanks for the spreadsheet :cheers:). This is a guy who constantly says that playing with better players makes you better, but is resisting the move to pro.

[all2common]

I think Magilla hit the nail on the head.

[Matt B.]

Looks like said he would be playing Pro Master's later in the year but just needs to hone his skills in Adv Masters first. There are a lot of differences he needs to learn about before making the jump into Pro Master's.

2nd place Advanced in the ORS doesn't hone skills in Advanced Masters. What, does he need to get used to the taste of Geritol and the delicious burn of Salonpas? :nahnah:

[chris7graham]

MPM Chris Graham 43 82.11 1 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 190 12 0.2368 82.11 lol im 11th place not 12 th flash


11 Chris Graham 31451 901 63 899 53 996 60 879 +14 176


ty flash for all your hard work

[chris7graham]

Id have to agree with this one.....:slapface:

When playing at the TOP of the adv. field and then moving to Adv Masters is more like moving DOWN..not even "sideways".
Sandbagger move if you ask me.....:nono:

Come on up to the REAL Masters divison Sammy boy...unless of course you are scared.
:laughing::laughing:

:nahnah:

LMAO SAM MOVE UP TO PRO MASTERS DONT BE A BAGGER:nahnah::shocked:

[smobro]

No Smo, yo I went pro, bro.


Hey playa Im just sayin, If you would have gone Masters, you would be pimpin, say in aint so, but now you is a pro ho giving up all that dough just for show. Later bro, I gots ta go.:shooting::shooting::biggrin2: