DR Course Changes

[Lyounger]

Chris Re, the SDGA Facilities Coordinator is heading the project to propose changes to the DownRiver Disc Golf course. He is requesting feedback from anyone who has 2 cents to add.

The basic discussion has revolved around three options:

1. An immediate fix to resolve saftey issues caused by over-lapping fairways that would include the removal of three holes resulting in an 18 hole layout.

2. An intermediate restructuring that would happen soon to resolve the over-lapping of the three holes but keep a 21 hole lay out.

3. A substantial redesign of the course that would take place over the next year.

Chris will be checking this forum for your feedback and will present an update on our progress to the SDGA membership at our next club meeting on Tuesday April 21st at 6:30 at the Season Ticket. Please provide feedback to Chris before that date.

Chris and the other SDGA board members would like to thank everyone who has voiced their opinions so far. It's very helpful to hear from you.

Thanks,
Lesli

[C-Re']

The club will be deciding at the next meeting how we will be moving foreward
1. Our first option is to pull holes 6, 10 and 12 and to swap teepads for 1 and 20

2. Our second option is to do some minor changes to the layout which i
will have several options to choose from based on input from club members.

3. Our third option is to follow option one and then at the end of the sept.
do a complete redesign of the course.

any input on option 1 for holes 1 and 20 would be appretiated
and any input on partial redesigns( similar to the two temporary layouts)

Thanks Christopher Re'

[Iceman]

Well, first of all, I know that you won't be able to please everybody. It is a daunting task and I know that whatever happens will be for the best. My suggestion is that you take out hole 6 and 12. Combine 7-8 to make one hole, with some redesign of tee/pin placement. As for 9-10 cross, it is in my opinion that visually, a player can see 10's tee from 9's tee, and vise versa. So I feel that those two could stay the same way. After 11 one could hike up and play what is now 21, making what is now hole 13, become hole 18. Hole 1 and 20, well that is a concern and don't know what to do there. Both of those holes are great the way they are, but it is a big blind cross where people can get hurt. By switching the pins, hole 1 play to 20, and hole 20 play to hole 1, breaks up the flow of the course. Having to walk back to hole 2, and having to cross the fairway to finish on what would be 18(old 13).
Or pull the whole course and redesign. I've played the layout proposed and like some of the holes, but didn't feel "Wow, that is so much better!" Most of the long holes were gone and still had some flow issues. I don't know what the answer is, but know that there are safety concerns that need to be resolved. GOOD LUCK!

[sk8architecture]

HEy there. Its been awhile since playing downriver since now I'm on the West Side but that was a fun course and I remeber what holes your talking about as far as crossing and safety. My 2:

Yeah 21 holes is nice however I'm one of those that would rather see 18 holes wich included a couple of dominating holes. If its 18 holes but on 3 of those holes you are forced to throw a drive twice to get to the approach then its like you played 18.

Like Iceman said you're not going to please everyone. And unfortuntly with your efforts of safety and flow someone is going to come out of the wood work to complain. Good Luck with your efforts and I look forward to the Lilac City Open!

[coryreu]

I like icemans ideas for holes 8-10. Hole 10 is a pretty sweet hole and I would hate to see it go. I think the biggest safety issue in that section of the course is the players teeing off 10 are endangering the players putting on 8. Players teeing on 9 and 10 can see one another, but to alleviate those crosses, possibly play 9 the way we have in DROs and LCOs.
As for holes 1 and 20, I think the issues in that section of the course go deeper than those 2 holes. Just switching those tees wont really solve much. Those may be the only 2 holes that cross, but there are a few other holes that with a slightly arrant drive, you're into another fairway, on another hole's green, or another hole's tee pad. So maybe that section of the course does need a good overhaul.

[Timber]

I think the changes voted on last night are a good first step towards resolving the immediate issues until a full redesign can be addressed. I also think for a while there are going to be some confused people out there looking for, or still throwing on, holes that aren't there, and it will be up to all of us to be helpful and explain the changes and the reasons for them when we meet those folks.

[Eric whippet Brown]

What is the change so that way Im not one of those confused people throwing at the wrong hole, but that could be my new excuse

[Parks]

Flipping pins/tees for holes 1 and 20.

Pulling 6.

Pulling 8.

Shortening 9.

Pulling 12.

All are supposed to be temporary through the summer while a layout that improves the play and safety of the course is devised.

[Eric whippet Brown]

So is the tee box (pad-mat) going to be where the river comes through during one of our flood stages or up on the side of the hill somewhere? If its only temp while the safety issues get resolved down lower makes sense but we know the river will come up again sometime so leaving it there would be sorta silly. I think when 9 gets shortend we should take the tee sign off so not to get it vandalized and move the mat to its new location. I would like to have Tyler help with all the physical stuff on my behalf, Peace. Oh yeah where is the tee gonna be???

[Parks]

No clue.

I would rather switch 9's teepad with 10's pin.

It would cut out the crossing danger, keep the holes good, and wouldn't get flooded.

[Eric whippet Brown]

So I walk into Downriver and I get on hole 1 and throw to 20's basket? And then I walk back up 1's fairway and around the rock pile that way or around the other side of the rock pile up fairway 2? Is that the layout so far because that doesnt sound safe anyway you look at it?

[Eric whippet Brown]

Ok I need to know what number hole 13 would be in the new layout? Would it be hole 18?

[Parks]

I believe that 20's tee to 1's pin is the new #1.

Then its all the same as usual, except hole 21 is now after current 11, and current tee #1 to 20's pin is after current 19. Current hole 13 is the new 18 as you presume, and it brings you back to the start.

Its similar to the flow of the 18 hole layout played in handicap tournies a couple years ago.

[Parks]

The other way to do it is 1's tee to 20's pin off the start, then current 13, then 20's tee to 1's pin.

Then you play through normally, with 21 after 11, and 19 being the last hole.

Either way works.

[C-Re']

hole 9 is staying as is
teepad 20 to basket 1 is hole one
teepad 1 to basket 20 is hole 17
both teepads will be moved

[Eric whippet Brown]

Oh Ok thanks.

[Timber]

Is there a timetable for when the changes take effect?

[Eric whippet Brown]

No real time table but its happening now, basket #6 is out of the ground. I dont know if it will be back in anytime soon? LCO is around the corner and I dont know if we play that hole or not? That poor basket has seen better days Im glad I aced it before it goes away for ever:cheerleader:

[General Scales]

I love and hate the idea's of changing Downriver. I love trying to eliminate the criss crossing of holes. Love the idea of flipping 20 and 1. Hate the idea of eliminating 6 as it's one of my favorites. The idea's I've been playing in my head are as follows:

1.) Flip 20 and 1.
2.) Move the tee-pad and basket of 4 to further up the hill. Perhaps stick the basket down in tree's further up on the trail.
3.) Keep 6 but play it to the basket of 7 instead.
4.) Eliminate 7 as it's kind of a weak hole. Or keep the tee pad of 7, eliminate 8 and throw to the basket of 8 for a long par 4 or possibly 5?
5.) Throw 9 from the Clowns Mouth position and move the basket if possible to a further back position, perhaps back behind the big tree it sits in front of now.
6.) Throw 11 from it's original position but to basket 6. Perhaps move 6 behind the tree to make it more difficult.
7.) Eliminate 12 because it crosses 3 and 3 is a superior hole. Or keep 12 and move the pad way up across the dirt road up the hill. Make it a short 200 footer. Downriver should have one easy hole :)
8.) Move the tee-pad of 18 back off the trail and back into the trees. This makes a touch tunnel shot, eliminates a lot of lost discs down the bank to the right and stops disc golfer pollution of the river due to climbing down the banks to retrieve errant throws.

This I think would eliminate most of the crossing problems. This also takes care of those people that would be pissed off at losing 6 since it's one of the more popular holes on the course. Keeps it a 20 too but keeps the par in check with what it is in a tournament round. Maybe even takes off a stroke if 7 to 8 became a four and not a 5. Just some things I've been kicking around.

Stu

[Parks]

No real time table but its happening now, basket #6 is out of the ground. I dont know if it will be back in anytime soon? LCO is around the corner and I dont know if we play that hole or not? That poor basket has seen better days Im glad I aced it before it goes away for ever:cheerleader:

Cornbread's putt was just too much of a monster for that basket.

It was actually kinda funny watching him can a nice birdie and then seeing the basket fall over from the force.

[Eric whippet Brown]

What are you talking about putting a basket behind a tree?:headbang: That makes any hole just plain lame. And as far as 18's pad goes putting it in the old position is making it way easier, thats why we have highbridge:yawn:. The fact of not shanking a shot over the LEFT side of the fairway on 18 is the challenge that even the pro's have a problem with so I think we need to leave that there. I do like the idea of adding a par 4, I just got back from the Beaver State Fling and I have never been happier to get a 4 on a hole.:yay: But to make it a par 5 would be to short in my book, Milo McIver has a par 5 but it is an 1100' hole.:shocked: You mentioned DR needed a easy hole go and throw hole 1 now, that is Cheezy easy.:puke: And add in the fact that our long bomber hole 20 is alot easier also, Im thinking with the added changes, double digits under par should be reached by more people now. So now with the chages the course got easier I would say, I wish we could make it harder by adding some distance to some holes. Now its just a lil bit above HB and I dont really like playing there because of how easy it is.

[Timber]

Now its just a lil bit above HB and I dont really like playing there because of how easy it is.

I wish I could say that, HB kicks my rear on a regular basis. PB = 58 :waaah::biggrin2:

With DR 12 gone, one way to regain some length on 20 would be moving the basket further back and to the north, say into the area northeast of the big tree across the road from the hole 3 basket. I think that position would actually be longer than the old 20. Or would that put 13's tee in the line of fire too much? (I'm using the old hole numbers for familiarity's sake; I assume they will eventually be renumbered in the new layout).

[Eric whippet Brown]

I was sitting down on hole 1 today and was listening to alot of people there and they all said about the same thing. The course looks alot easier now that hole 1 and 20 has changed, in fact I put my disc under both baskets with minimal effort tailwind. Hole 20 is about 50' shorter making it a 400' hole and 1 is just a putter toss? Oh well I guess it will have to work it just sucks hole 1 was a fun hole now its a lame duck but aceable. Getting anything moved as in baskets is a joke ask Matt and Troy that spent a day or two digging new pin placements that never even got the time of day, waste of time and energy there but good job guys the thought was there. Maybe in the next couple of years we can get new alt pin locations but I dont think that is going to happen as the course has been established for over 9 years that I know of and it has stayed the same for the most part. Im not trying to rip on anyone here I do like what the SDGA has done for the disc golf community and do understand that we do need the changes for safety and its going to be a take a lil getting used to at least for me.

[Eric whippet Brown]

The trash cans are a really nice addition to the course, lets hope we can keep them around. I forgot how we got the trash cans or who put them in but thanks thats a great improvement to the course. I think C-Re put them in so if so :yay:.

[Timber]

New 1 is definitely a lot easier, I've gotten a 2 both times I've played it so far and I had never birdied the old one. New 20 is shorter, yeah, but I don't think it's any easier, at least for my skill level. There is more junk in the way and the angles seem narrower. Not worse, just different.

+1 on the garbage cans.

[General Scales]

Just got done playing the new 1 and 20 and your totally right. I birdied old one a few times but never had a drop in for a birdie considering my drives always ended up left of the basket for wicked hyzer putts. Yesterday dropped a drive to under the basket. Not fun at all. 20 was a par. Not as long but not terribly easy.

As for not moving 18 back into the trees because the pad on the trail is harder...meh :whistler: I had troubles with it on the path before but just because I was using the wrong discs. Depending on my mood now I either anhyzer my SS Avenger and it will go right for days or I throw a Venom for a long thumber. Never lost one or even come close to losing one. Watched tons of people do it though :laughing:

Garbage cans kick ass.

[Eric whippet Brown]

Hole 1 was aced yesterday by Avery Jenkins:shocked: and he also birdied 11:bowing: and did a sick anhyzer on old hole 21 and put it behind the basket in the trees and made his put.:slapface:. So he just walks in here and makes the course look like a pitch and putt:yawn: I get to play with him in the 1st round of the LCO:D so I cant wait to have him kick my a$$ on my home course:puke:, good lessons but expensive unless I can keep up with him for the 2nd and 3rd round's also.

[Eric whippet Brown]

The trash cans are a really nice addition to the course, lets hope we can keep them around. I forgot how we got the trash cans or who put them in but thanks thats a great improvement to the course. I think C-Re put them in so if so :yay:.

I was wondering if the person that has the key to the park could please empty out some of the cans they put out, they are overflowing with garbage and to heavy to carry out. If you dont want to do a weekly dumping which it really needs but hasnt seen since they were put in, I think I could do that but Im not the person in charge of that.

[Parks]

Need to just run a cheap doubles round out there once every other week and have groups bring the bag from their last hole to where it can be picked up.

[Eric whippet Brown]

Thats true but I think there is a reason we have a key, the trash cans got down there by use of the key, it was easy to put the empty trash cans on the course so it should be used to empty them as well? But I pack it in and pack it out so I shouldnt have to worry about it, but it summertime and with all the traffic we get it would be nice to have a schedule that matches the city's garbage day down there. Maybe we can have a new position for someone in the club being the Garbage man, can we vote on that? Something needs to be done? I hate even thinking about family's with there kids trying to have fun and seeing heaping cans of garbage on every other hole, not a pretty site.

[joeroyer]

When will the club decide on the final changes to be made to the course. The course is flowing fairly well, but I think a new layout should be considered. With no tournaments scheduled there until next years DRO, it seems like a good time to start better utilizing the great piece of land we have there.